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Is peaceful revolution possible?
#1
Is peaceful revolution possible?
Is peaceful revolution possible?

I’ve been thinking about this question, and I feel the answer is NO.

We are taught that violence is always bad, and that we should use peaceful options such as dialogue to change society. But this is clearly contradictory with reality. The powerful employ violence to keep us under control. Why then is it forbidden for us?

History has taught us that violence has been fundamental in social change. Take the French Revolution for example.

I know violence is ugly. But I think that, at least for now, it is still needed. Society still hasn’t advanced to the point where violence isn’t needed anymore.
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#2
RE: Is peaceful revolution possible?
A calm manner is easier to ignore, whereas one is forced to pay attention to the violent outburst.
[Image: mtfbwyf.jpg]
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#3
RE: Is peaceful revolution possible?
(October 7, 2021 at 4:12 am)Macoleco Wrote: Is peaceful revolution possible?

I’ve been thinking about this question, and I feel the answer is NO.

We are taught that violence is always bad, and that we should use peaceful options such as dialogue to change society. But this is clearly contradictory with reality. The powerful employ violence to keep us under control. Why then is it forbidden for us?

History has taught us that violence has been fundamental in social change. Take the French Revolution for example.

I know violence is ugly. But I think that, at least for now, it is still needed. Society still hasn’t advanced to the point where violence isn’t needed anymore.

History records dozens of peaceful/nonviolent political revolutions. Bear in mind that 'nonviolent revolution' only means that those in revolt don't employ violence, it doesn't mean that the people you're revolting against won't happily park a tank on your face.

Then there are social and economic revolutions, most of which have always been peaceful.

Boru
‘Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.’ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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#4
RE: Is peaceful revolution possible?
Whether the violence is justified or not matters. If some Bojo decides to get in my pants over my objections, I would be happy to plant a knife someplace he would find inconvenient.
[Image: Fenrir-sign.jpg]
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#5
RE: Is peaceful revolution possible?
I smile a little when I hear someone say, ‘Violence never solves anything.’ Violence solves a whole lotta stuff. Always has.

Boru
‘Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.’ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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#6
RE: Is peaceful revolution possible?
Here's a list of non-violent revolutions that actually worked out. Of course, in my experience, this tends to only work if the power structure being revolted against actually has the sort of morality or sensitivity to optics that would let them relent on certain points without being slaughtered. If we're talking about a non-violent revolution in today's climate, well, given that the right has become so thoroughly inoculated from reality or any sort of shame to the point where they attempted to overthrow the government just because their preferred candidate lost the election, or that it's become disturbingly common for people to respond to "if you don't get vaccinated, this pandemic is going to keep going on forever" with "then let us die", I highly doubt it. And, since I suspect Macoleco is from Brazil (searching the name gives a lot of results in Portuguese), and what little I know about Bolsonaro tells me that he's even worse than Trump was (at least Trump pushed back a little on his downplaying of COVID after he got it; no such luck with Bolsonaro), I'd put the odds of a successful Non-Violent revolution to be pretty fucking infinitessimal.
I was born with a gift of laughter and a sense that the world is mad.

[Image: harmlesskitchen.png]

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#7
RE: Is peaceful revolution possible?
(October 7, 2021 at 4:12 am)Macoleco Wrote: Is peaceful revolution possible?

I’ve been thinking about this question, and I feel the answer is NO.

We are taught that violence is always bad, and that we should use peaceful options such as dialogue to change society. But this is clearly contradictory with reality. The powerful employ violence to keep us under control. Why then is it forbidden for us?

History has taught us that violence has been fundamental in social change. Take the French Revolution for example.

I know violence is ugly. But I think that, at least for now, it is still needed. Society still hasn’t advanced to the point where violence isn’t needed anymore.

Peaceful resistance is always possible. Anthony and King made great strides in changing society. But tribalism globally, and unfortunately will not go away. Humans do not widely have the benefit of understanding that we all live on the same planet, and all of us need resources, so we make all sorts of excuses to be on top, be it religious, or political or economic. 

I get frustrated having conversed with people all over the world, whom agree with me, that we are too tribal. One of my newest friend is from Pakistan, and while we butt heads on politics sometimes, he for his country, is very liberal. He is an atheist, and doesn't understand, for example why we have such a gun violence problem. Just today, he argued that Dems have both the House and Senate and Presidency, and cant understand why we cant get a grip on that issue.

I can't explain to him it isn't as simple as that. 

But it isn't just about guns. America is really unique in our setup. We are not a pure majority rule, ON ANY ISSUE. It is a double edge sword to me. I don't want a pure majority rule, but I also don't want a minority rule either. I think the founders, as flawed as they were, got some aspects right in their intent, but at the same time, could not know how much the world would change in over the centuries. 

People railed against Muhammad Ali for objecting to the Vietnam War, and he was right. It wasn't about vilifying the soldiers, it was about  criticizing congressional/presidential policy. Why did we get stuck there, or Iraq, or Afghanistan? Why is it today, we are worried about our national security, and those left behind that now feel abandon? The Vietnamese whom were left behind, felt the same way. 

I fear global conflict, not because I think we are always wrong. I'd still prefer to live in America rather than China or Cuba or Pakistan or Iran. I fear global conflict because humans now live in an age of mutual destruction. And when I think of my friend in Pakistan, I don't want a global conflict to kill him. Just like I don't want a global conflict to kill all the other decent people whom simply happen to live under governments my government does not get along with.

It may sound cliche but there is a line from the movie "Red Dawn" from the shot down fighter jet pilot whom the kids ran across, and the pilot basically said that sometimes the big boys fight. 

It is sad in reality that humans fight. It would be awesome if we did not, but unfortunately it is the reality we live in.
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#8
RE: Is peaceful revolution possible?
I have GOT to get that pool started…

Boru
‘Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.’ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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#9
RE: Is peaceful revolution possible?
It's not whether we fight, the OP was talking about how we fight. I do not think in my lifetime "world peace" will be achieved, doesn't mean it shouldn't be a goal. To answer the OP I think a peaceful revolution is possible. It's not violence, but anarchy that is required for a revolution. The type of destruction necessary for that anarchy is very fluid. It could be, obstructing traffic, toting guns, genocide, etc., and I don't see why in a primarily fiscally driven society in a capitalist country, how you spend your $$ couldn't be a radical call for change. Fundamentally the US economy isn't townsfolk marching with pitchforks anymore (Karen's aside), and we're also not held at gunpoint to buy certain things. I don't see why poicy and politics can't be derived from the whims of consumerism for intelligent enough consumers. There in lies the rub, getting enough intelligent and consciences cats herded to make a difference in someone important's bottom line.


Here's a for instance. Aliens came down tomorrow and supplied enough methods of energy and replicators (star trek reference) to the entire world. We are no longer the center of the universe, we have all our needs met, and they take us to other planets so there's not a space/resources issue. With no resources to fight for and a global unity(we are earthlings) , what would be the goal of individuals? How would society operate and how would it be changed?
"There ought to be a term that would designate those who actually follow the teachings of Jesus, since the word 'Christian' has been largely divorced from those teachings, and so polluted by fundamentalists that it has come to connote their polar opposite: intolerance, vindictive hatred, and bigotry." -- Philip Stater, Huffington Post

always working on cleaning my windows- me regarding Johari
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#10
RE: Is peaceful revolution possible?
Do the aliens have enemies? Will they lend us some of their warships?
It's bad for the rest of the world when americans are paid so little they can only afford chocolate mined by child slaves and clothes made in overseas sweatshops. - Robyn Pennacchia
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