Can America ever truly pay for its sins?

[Angrboda]

"Hate the sin, love the sinner. Btw, you're going to hell for your sins."

[The Grand Nudger]

It depends on how they say it and to whom. Children and college students are more impressionable than older adults for example. Any objective facts can be presented in a manner that pushes an agenda.

When you say it depends, you're talking about it being appropriate..depending.  Americans are not appropriate.  I'm just telling you that yes, it's very very american to give people shit for their faults, more so if you care for them than if you don't. 

I don't tease other peoples friends and sisters, know what I mean?  
 

---

CRT for example is just not an objective or even fair take on history or current events. It's more ideology than facts. For instance, it makes the false assumption that any disparity in outcome is proof of discrimination. Individual choices or other circumstances don't seem to be factored in. Intersectionality is purely ideological to me, I don't believe you can lump all these different groups (blacks, trans, women, atheists) together and somehow assume their issues are similar.

CRT is extremely myopic in its analysis of let's say encounters between cops and black suspects. Take for example the George Floyd case. It's clear that the cop Derek Chauvin used excessive force and that cops in the US seem to be poorly trained to handle a suspect going through some kind of drug crisis. But there's no proof that he was motivated by hatred of black people. Advocates of CRT don't consider that maybe Chauvin has an inherently violent personality or that he simply lost patience with a difficult suspect. That wouldn't be a good excuse, but it would show he wasn't racist.

---

You don't know what CRT is.  There, that's done.  There's no point in arguing about it - its not an actual issue.  You just know that it's media noise you're supposed to object to.  Who's ideology do you think you're consuming when you do so?  

Hint, starts with a w, ends in ist.

---

To state or imply that Floyd was killed for being black (and by that extension if you're black, you might be next if you don't do something about it) is grossly irresponsible, not backed up by evidence any more than any religion is, and has sparked riots that actually got other black people killed. Floyd himself is not entirely blameless in the matter, he'd been in trouble with the law before, he got himself heavily intoxicated in public to the point where I'm not even sure his grip on reality was still there (you can see him in the video acting like a crazy person), he failed to follow lawful police instructions. Put yourself in his shoes (you can be black for the sake of argument) and realize that if you simply did what the cops told you, Derek Chauvin wouldn't even be present. Oh that's right, he was not the officer first responding to the scene, he only came after the previous officers failed to control him.

That's not to excuse Derek's poor judgment but I do say it to argue that it's extremely unlikely a regular black person would have been killed in this circumstance.

This is what many in the woke media do all the time, take a story, put a spin on it to weave a narrative of widespread racism that just isn't supported by the evidence and in fact is actually quite implausible when there are more likely explanations.

I also wanted to point out that you can have legit racist cops treating black suspects fairly. It all depends what they value more. Maybe some cops value their duty more than their racism. Thoughts don't always translate into behavior. This is why it's silly to try to equate all police brutality with racism.

---

Straight to floyd.  Whose song do you think you're marching to, as you extoll what you see as the problems of a nonexistent radical left in the us vis a vis these culture war hot buttons?  

---

Well, the question I'd have is if there are any truly empty lands left in the world apart from maybe Antarctica or some remote island nobody cares about?

Pretty much everything of value has been claimed in some form or another. Even those empty lands in the US actually have some rangers overseeing them, there is satellite coverage, powerlines, police responds if it's ever necessary, like if you get lost there. It doesn't seem to be quite as empty anymore.

Either way, it's impractical to revert to what existed pre-US. The closest thing to justice would be having a libertarian-like system with low taxes so no faction feels like they're forced to follow rules they never agreed with unless the non-aggression principle is violated.

---

By the 1600's?  No, we were all pretty well dispersed at that point.  Lowering taxes for the rich would further privilege the exploitative class - and do nothing to either disadvantaged communities or the working white poor.  We know, we've tried. Things don't trickle down. You wanna help people change their circumstances permanently? Give them money. Cash money. Works every time. Turns out that poor people are better informed about what they need and what they can do, and make more responsible decisions with that money, than some suburban mom or dad 1k miles away concerned about The Blacks using up all the government cheese in the Antifa run city of Detroit. Works for foreign aid too, strangely. Libertarianism means something different in other countries, I'm told.  Here, it was the racist vote before you could just say you were racist and that was acceptable.  An early test bubble for economic anxiety.

---

Slave owners probably had a lot of money back in the day, but no, such wealth wouldn't survive to 2021 without effort, especially given the number of heirs, it would be very fragmented and people had way more children back then. An estate like that needs to be maintained else it crumbles to dust. Leave any property uninhabited for a few years with no maintenance, you're not going to be able to live in it. Land needs to be worked to have any utility, crops don't grow by themselves. Money needs to be re-invested into a profitable asset (like a good business) else it loses its value through inflation. This is how wealthy families are no longer wealthy after several generations. And very few white people actually had slaveholding relatives anyway. Lots came to the US with nothing to their name, do they still have this white privilege thing?

A slave could have earned some money and passed it down to his son or daughter so they wouldn't have to start from scratch. Or built a "shack" for them but keep in mind that shacks don't last a lifetime. If you can't maintain those properties they become worthless sooner or later.

Or (as is the case with many people of all races) he could have spent it all during his lifetime, leaving nothing for his descendants.

Or he may have had so many descendants it all got fragmented to the point it didn't matter.

Never rely on your parents for wealth or income. Build it yourself. And even if you get a lot, assume it's going to be lost very soon unless you invest it well.

---

Most slave owners were poor. By the end, people had slaves like we have consumer goods. Poor men had yet poorer slaves. That was the value of a mans life. Funnily, the system wasn't actually good for anyone. Slaves couldn't earn money, build or pass down anything of their own.  That's not how slavery works. Freed men, in our history, didn't have that option either. Sure, officially, but not in mere reality.

---

Discrimination. The white man is being reverse racism-d
Rights abrogation. The white mans rights and protections are being eroded, his wealth transferred to non whites.
Stigmatization and the denial of pride. The country is being slandered.
Loss of self esteem. The white man is being villainized.
Racial Elimination. The white man is being breed out.

This sounds a lot like moving the goalpost.

White supremacy just means someone believes whites are better than everyone else, nothing more.

Believing that there is discrimination against whites is not white supremacy and the CRT proponents have a demonstrable bias against white people. You cannot genuinely say you're for equality and tolerance but then turn around and say things like:
- "racism against whites doesn't exist because whites are privileged" (as if this was relevant)
- "Whiteness is bad" (how would we react if people were saying Blackness or Jewishness is bad? you would think the article was written by a Nazi if you replaced "white" with "Jew")
- "the c-word isn't as bad as the n-word" (why?)
- "check your privilege, white people"

I'm actually sympathetic to a world where people just ignore race altogether and focus on common values and individual merit which is why CRT looks like such a bad joke to me. In fact, it's self-refuting. If you want people of different races to get along they have to follow the same standard, you can't have overt racism being tolerated just because it comes from a group that is oppressed or perceived as oppressed.

I could say the same thing about the other 4 points, those points could be valid or invalid, but they don't necessarily involve white supremacy. Some white supremacists bring them up, but so do plenty of people who aren't.

---

I'm telling you what contemporary white supremacy in the united states is, what it's organized around, how it sells itself.  You can go research it yourself if you like..but, if you think it's "moving the goalposts"..well, huzzah, you figured it out.  White supremacy was a fading brand that very successfully reinvigorated itself by changing it's propagandistic appeals. It;s not recent work, either, they spun this up back in the 90s and immediately knew they'd hit gold. As they had always contended, more americans than would vote for "white supremacy" on a ticket spelled just like that absolutely do vote on the basis of a belief about white subjugation or genocide. Additionally, as it's a fundamentally liberal appeal it simultaneously trolls the libs and resonates with people who cannot possibly believe that they, themselves, are in an active dissemenators position..and yet they are. Probably shouldn't have written them off as yokels and hicks - that helps them blindside people who think they're too smart or antithetically aligned to buy in.

Something to consider, when you consider your positions as stated - If I were you I'd look into getting my info elsewhere - elsewhere with respect to wherever the hell you've been getting it from. I lose alot of people here, and it's a shame, I'm only speaking from experience. Back in the day when I was full on in the tank for the folk if I heard someone opining the way you'd have I'd know that I had a sympathetic ear even if they didn't know it. That much of the work was already done. Basic information asymmetry. A person that accepts the pillars of white supremacy but does not consider themselves a white supremacist doesn't need to be convinced of the truth of white supremacy - they already believe it, or believe at least a part of it. They are merely waiting to be activated. To be given something to do about it. Most people never get past voting on it - but that's a pretty huge achievement even if you never quite convince them to take up arms for the future of their race. In my experience, the race soldiers come pre-made. The rest of the normies are either leaners or hard no's. Some will some wont so what.

This is what drives institutional racism, the thing crt concerns itself with as a graduate level field of study in law and sociology, for what it's worth. Not how a country of hood wearing klansmen effect a white supremacist nation..that needs no explanation - but how a country chock full of people who either publicly or genuinely detest white supremacy can, somehow, end up with a country that looks no different than the one built by the guys in hoods. A country like mine. A country I love. A country that needs to be improved because it's loved. If no one gave a shit, we could keep on being a garbage fire until the end of days. Bit like teasing someone else's sister.

The short version is this. If you sound like an episode of tucker, you're a fuckin racist. If you don't want to be, then you're faced with the same essential question that buy in leaners are... what are you gonna do about it? There's no universe in which any of those five pillars are true, and no..Other People™ don't believe in them. Just out and out racists and fence sitting racists in training. Hell..Even I realized they were bullshit before I stopped using them. So, there you go, that's what you're up against. Your entire post clearly informed by a particular ideology with which you would deny any particular involvement. OFC..I used to tell people I wasn't a nazi too..and it was true, I suppose.

[ToTheMoon]

When you say it depends, you're talking about it being appropriate..depending.  Americans are not appropriate.  I'm just telling you that yes, it's very very american to give people shit for their faults, more so if you care for them than if you don't.

I don't tease other peoples friends and sisters, know what I mean?

Hmm, would giving people shit for their faults include say criticism of criminals who hide behind a minority identity in an attempt to avoid accountability?

You don't know what CRT is.  There, that's done.  There's no point in arguing about it - its not an actual issue.  You just know that it's media noise you're supposed to object to.  Who's ideology do you think you're consuming when you do so?  

Hint, starts with a w, ends in ist.

When this line of thinking reaches a point where it sparks multiple riots in multiple cities and causes people to think they have nothing to lose, that if they don't revolt they're next on some kill list or whatever, then it's an issue.

Straight to floyd.  Whose song do you think you're marching to, as you extoll what you see as the problems of a nonexistent radical left in the us vis a vis these culture war hot buttons?

 
This assumes that there are only two options when dealing with race issues in the US, agree with everything far left progressives say or adopt the position that whites are better than everyone else.

I reject both and yes it is a valid choice to reject both positions. Actual racists would equally regard me as a useful idiot for the woke side, basically a naive liberal. But there is a third way and it's to just ignore race altogether and treat people fairly on their own merits. I don't think any of this divisive rhetoric on the left helps at all. I hope that 30 years from now this fad will pass and people will look back in shame.

By the 1600's?  No, we were all pretty well dispersed at that point.  Lowering taxes for the rich would further privilege the exploitative class - and do nothing to either disadvantaged communities or the working white poor.  We know, we've tried. Things don't trickle down. You wanna help people change their circumstances permanently? Give them money. Cash money. Works every time.

Giving money to everyone just dilutes the value of that money. Increasing how much money people have is not going to increase the number of goods and services up for sale.

As someone with a pretty high tax burden in Romania, I am not impressed. Over 50% of my income goes to the government one way or another and the services I get in return are mediocre at best, terrible at worst. And no, don't google the 10% income tax, that's just one of the many taxes you pay. Health is another 10%. Pension is another whopping 25%. VAT is 19% for most things. The public pension system is a complete failure rife with corruption and flagrant inequities, why? I pay the same amount as a cop, judge or politician, but they get to retire early with fat pensions while I don't even get back what I paid into the system adjusted for inflation. Social security is even more of a fraud here than it is in the US. In both cases if you die before your 60's your family gets nothing. People would be better off ditching social security and just investing in the stock market for the long haul. The returns are much better, your kids can inherit the portfolio if you die young and you don't have to burden the government with unsustainable debt.

On top of that, poor people are still poor, I still see homeless people even if it's not as bad as the early 90's and most small towns are plagued by wild dogs and crumbling infrastructure. It is no exaggeration to say that if I'm paying over 50% I at least expect way better.

We have universal healthcare here, but with the quality and quantity offered don't envy us. If you have something serious like cancer, you're better off having it in the US even if you get into debt. At least you're more likely to live. I don't know anyone who has money and relies exclusively on the public sector. If this system works so well, why does private insurance still exist?

But there is another good reason to have small government with low taxes. Having limited resources means it won't be able to enforce pointless, cruel and unjust laws like putting people in cages for weed, gambling or prostitution. It will be busy enough dealing with real crimes.

The short version is this. If you sound like an episode of tucker, you're a fuckin racist. If you don't want to be, then you're faced with the same essential question that buy in leaners are... what are you gonna do about it?

Treat people fairly and not based on what their skin looks like. I don't need to embrace all these radical theories that by their very nature cannot possibly achieve their stated goal anyway.

EDIT: It's also not enough to claim that something is racist or promotes white supremacism, you have to show it too and this progressive ideology is way too quick to expand the definition of racism to something we don't commonly think of as racist or to look for racism where none exists.

Is black supremacy a problem as well? How about female supremacy or Native American supremacy or do they get a pass just because... reasons?

[Anomalocaris]

Is black supremacy a problem as well? How about female supremacy or Native American supremacy or do they get a pass just because... reasons?

Because they do not reflect, and do not come anywhere close to reflecting, any overall economic or social advantage.  They are problems that are, on the whole, not at all real problems. 

White supremacy do not get a pass because it reflects existing and massive overall systemic economic and social inequality.  It is a problem that is actually a huge and very real problem.

[The Architect Of Fate]

So we have another person who writes word walls of utter Tripe 

[The Grand Nudger]

Hmm, would giving people shit for their faults include say criticism of criminals who hide behind a minority identity in an attempt to avoid accountability?

Here I was thinking I was talking to a person who just had bad info.  Looks a bit worse than that now.

When this line of thinking reaches a point where it sparks multiple riots in multiple cities and causes people to think they have nothing to lose, that if they don't revolt they're next on some kill list or whatever, then it's an issue.

Who thinks they need to revolt in order to avoid being on a kill list, or whatever? Obviously, the race obsessed, who believe in white genocide..but they felt that way before anyone invented the crt crisis.

 

This assumes that there are only two options when dealing with race issues in the US, agree with everything far left progressives say or adopt the position that whites are better than everyone else.

I reject both and yes it is a valid choice to reject both positions. Actual racists would equally regard me as a useful idiot for the woke side, basically a naive liberal. But there is a third way and it's to just ignore race altogether and treat people fairly on their own merits. I don't think any of this divisive rhetoric on the left helps at all. I hope that 30 years from now this fad will pass and people will look back in shame.

Ignoring race altogether is ignoring the animal in our house, eating our lunch.  Useful idiot, sure, but not for any woke side. I'm guessing that the only things you know about american progressivism are things you gleaned from whatever white supremacist dipshits you've been getting your info from. Not only is the crt thing completely made up...so is any american far left. It's just a boogeyman, you'e been scared shitless all the way across the world by a phantom invented to make ignorant domestics piss their pants.

Giving money to everyone just dilutes the value of that money. Increasing how much money people have is not going to increase the number of goods and services up for sale.

As someone with a pretty high tax burden in Romania, I am not impressed. Over 50% of my income goes to the government one way or another and the services I get in return are mediocre at best, terrible at worst. And no, don't google the 10% income tax, that's just one of the many taxes you pay. Health is another 10%. Pension is another whopping 25%. VAT is 19% for most things. The public pension system is a complete failure rife with corruption and flagrant inequities, why? I pay the same amount as a cop, judge or politician, but they get to retire early with fat pensions while I don't even get back what I paid into the system adjusted for inflation. Social security is even more of a fraud here than it is in the US. In both cases if you die before your 60's your family gets nothing. People would be better off ditching social security and just investing in the stock market for the long haul. The returns are much better, your kids can inherit the portfolio if you die young and you don't have to burden the government with unsustainable debt.

On top of that, poor people are still poor, I still see homeless people even if it's not as bad as the early 90's and most small towns are plagued by wild dogs and crumbling infrastructure. It is no exaggeration to say that if I'm paying over 50% I at least expect way better.

We have universal healthcare here, but with the quality and quantity offered don't envy us. If you have something serious like cancer, you're better off having it in the US even if you get into debt. At least you're more likely to live. I don't know anyone who has money and relies exclusively on the public sector. If this system works so well, why does private insurance still exist?

But there is another good reason to have small government with low taxes. Having limited resources means it won't be able to enforce pointless, cruel and unjust laws like putting people in cages for weed, gambling or prostitution. It will be busy enough dealing with real crimes.

There you go with your opinions again.  I just told you what actually works when the us does it - not whether it was an idea that would fit with your political sensibilities or whatever ludicrous taxation scheme you've got going in Romania.  Here in the us, the small government people mean less law enforcement of financial crimes..and more giant government fists all up the uterus. They want more police, and less latinos.

Treat people fairly and not based on what their skin looks like. I don't need to embrace all these radical theories that by their very nature cannot possibly achieve their stated goal anyway.

EDIT: It's also not enough to claim that something is racist or promotes white supremacism, you have to show it too and this progressive ideology is way too quick to expand the definition of racism to something we don't commonly think of as racist or to look for racism where none exists.

Is black supremacy a problem as well? How about female supremacy or Native American supremacy or do they get a pass just because... reasons?

It's plenty enough.  I can see you spooling up the hate engine.  Nevermind.   Fuck you, lost cause. It's interesting to see how our spent propaganda has a second life inside the mind of a random romanian, I suppose, but beyond that, meh. I'm still a some will some wont so what guy - and you appear to want to argue to me that the pillars of white supremacy are true. So lets ignore the fact that you're a bigot blurb generator and focus on how you're just plain wrong about things?

CRT isnt a problem, there is no radical or far left in the us to have an agenda, and white supremacy is an organizing principle of our institutions and politics.

[ToTheMoon]

Because they do not reflect, and do not come anywhere close to reflecting, any overall economic or social advantage.  They are problems that are, on the whole, not at all real problems. 

White supremacy do not get a pass because it reflects existing and massive overall systemic economic and social inequality.  It is a problem that is actually a huge and very real problem.

The point is nobody should get a pass. If nothing else, black supremacy will just encourage more white supremacy (actual literal definition, not the woke definition) which will encourage more black supremacy and so on and the cycle of stupid never ends. I have spoken to actual racists and they told me part of the reason they are the way they are is because they don't believe self-proclaimed opponents of racism are genuine and that there's no other choice but tribalism. I have no idea how you plan to change their minds using these extremely divisive tactics and double standards.

This is why it's hard to take the woke seriously because if they were really interested in ending racism without any other agenda or ulterior motive attached, they wouldn't care what the racist's skin color was or what his economic status or what horrible atrocity his ancestor suffered 6 generations ago, they'd just want everyone to cut it out and they wouldn't post racially inflammatory articles like "How To End Whiteness" or constantly imply that white people (many of which weren't in the US in the Jim Crow era, let alone the slavery period) bear some collective "sin" they need to "repent" of.

I remember when I got into fights in school, the teacher would break us up and tell us to be nice to each other. She couldn't give a shit which kid had more "privilege" or richer parents or whatever, everyone was expected to behave, no excuses.

Here I was thinking I was talking to a person who just had bad info. Looks a bit worse than that now.

The feeling is mutual just in case you were wondering.

Who thinks they need to revolt in order to avoid being on a kill list, or whatever?

Do you think it's a coincidence that people rioted all across the USA right after the murder of George Floyd?

Obviously, the race obsessed, who believe in white genocide..but they felt that way before anyone invented the crt crisis.

The problem with you is that you refuse to admit that there can be anything other two positions: yours or the position of someone like Richard Spencer.

Yes, there can be.

Don't look at it as fence-sitting either. It's more like active opposition to both of these positions.

Ignoring race altogether is ignoring the animal in our house, eating our lunch. Useful idiot, sure, but not for any woke side.

Favoritism is still discrimination. How can you solve discrimination with more discrimination?

Not to mention that a lot of allegations of discrimination can't even be substantiated or they have other more plausible explanations.

I'm guessing that the only things you know about american progressivism are things you gleaned from whatever white supremacist dipshits you've been getting your info from. Not only is the crt thing completely made up...so is any american far left. It's just a boogeyman, you'e been scared shitless all the way across the world by a phantom invented to make ignorant domestics piss their pants.

Can you tell me what is the exact thought process by which you came to the conclusion that these people are all white supremacists? Can we at least get a list of who you think is such among all the prominent media influencers? I'm going by the plain meaning of the words and how the average person would understand the term: people who believe that white people are better than everyone else (typically using this notion to justify white-only countries, segregation or special rights). I'm not seeing evidence for this.

As for where I get my views, I actually tend to not blindly follow what people tell me. I'll listen to anyone including people I strongly disagree with, but pass things through my own filter. I'll even listen to very fringe figures like actual communists, pro-Sharia theocrats and racists, helps to know your opponents. A lot of the negative views I have about the woke come from reading woke sources or listening to woke commentators. It is not the case that Tucker Carlson told me to think this way, it's more of a case of the woke "incriminate" themselves every time they speak.

There you go with your opinions again. I just told you what actually works when the us does it

Social security in the US is at least half as bad as in Romania as the core principle is the same. You pay a ton of money to the government in the hopes that in 40 years when you probably won't work anymore the government will give you some income until you die. But this is not sustainable, social security has serious deficits, it costs too much (about 12.4% of your income) and it relies on an ever-expanding population which is not going to be around forever as the trend is people having smaller families or no families at all.

You were better off just investing in the S&P500 all this time. Even a combination of investing in multiple actively managed funds (which historically have mostly failed to beat the S&P500) would have achieved better results. It is far better to invest in profitable business ventures for your retirement than to rely on how much taxes the government can get out of young people.

- not whether it was an idea that would fit with your political sensibilities or whatever ludicrous taxation scheme you've got going in Romania. Here in the us, the small government people mean less law enforcement of financial crimes..and more giant government fists all up the uterus. They want more police, and less latinos.

There's a lot of wrong to unpack there, for one thing it doesn't matter how much police you have, it matters that you have enough to control crime, that what counts as a crime is actually a crime (use the non-aggression principle as your guide, victimless crimes shouldn't be crimes at all) and that they're properly trained. The Floyd case could have been avoided if they were better trained to handle a heavily intoxicated suspect. It could have also been avoided if Floyd himself wasn't a complete idiot, again no evidence even after his 22.5 year conviction that Chauvin acted out of racism or that he even bears racist views. None. This is pure speculation by the media and does nothing but foster conflict. It is something a psychopath would do if he wanted to see people fight each other for kicks. Or a foreign state actor intending to weaken the social fabric of a rival country.

I won't dispute the fact that Republicans are usually hypocrites when they say they're for small government, including when it comes to economic issues, not just social issues. That's no reason for independent libertarians as well as libertarian-leaning members of the Republican Party to give up on their goals.

EDIT: I deal with far worse in my country as there is nothing close to a pro-liberty party, they're all economically left-leaning including the "liberal" party. But I'll just stubbornly vote for that sub-1% political party that has no chance of winning out of defiance.

It's plenty enough. I can see you spooling up the hate engine. Nevermind. Fuck you, lost cause.

All I see so far is all talk, no evidence, no proof, and you distort what words mean to push an agenda.

What hate am I promoting? I think people should treat each other fairly, I just reject the notion of guilt over what some ancestor did. Let's face it, almost everyone was terrible even 100 years ago and if they weren't, they simply did not have the opportunity to be terrible. Best you can do is learn from it and move on.

and you appear to want to argue to me that the pillars of white supremacy are true

I reject the pillars of white supremacy if by white supremacy you mean the literal definition of it.

If you mean something else, it is of no interest to me.

[The Grand Nudger]

Watching leaners mince words is boring. Shit or get off the bigot pot.

CRT is a non thing, you ask me if people riot by coincidence, doesn't matter..they didn't riot because of crt. Thats great replacement theory crackpot bullshit, and you bought it, and keep arguing it, while strongly denying that you bought it, just as your mealy mouthed rejection of white supremacy appears to be designed to allow for the pillars of white supremacy to be true..which you continue to argue they are.

There's your self incrimination, tool. It's too specific and american themed for some romanian to come up with it all on it's own, and for what that romanian came up with to be exactly the same as what our home grown white supremacists came up with, right down to complaining about the present imaginary articles of white supremacist fear in the us.

So, again, here's the thing. If you want to waste your time arguing that white supremacy is true, go pound sand. I'm not in the mood. If you want to argue that whatever political sensibilities you have are the right ones to have, again, go pound sand - I don't care how a romanian thinks the us should be organized and I never will. If you want to know how fucking hilariously you've been mislead on items of fact - then we can do that, but you'll have to engage.

[ToTheMoon]

Watching leaners mince words is boring. Shit or get off the bigot pot.

CRT is a non thing, you ask me if people riot by coincidence, doesn't matter..they didn't riot because of crt. Thats great replacement theory crackpot bullshit, and you bought it, and keep arguing it, while strongly denying that you bought it, just as your mealy mouthed rejection of white supremacy appears to be designed to allow for the pillars of white supremacy to be true..which you continue to argue they are.

There's your self incrimination, tool. It's too specific and american themed for some romanian to come up with it all on it's own, and for what that romanian came up with to be exactly the same as what our home grown white supremacists came up with, right down to complaining about the present imaginary articles of white supremacist fear.

So, again, here's the thing. If you want to waste your time arguing that white supremacy is true, go pound sand. I'm not in the mood. If you want to argue that whatever political sensibilities you have are the right ones to have, again, go pound sand - I don't care how a romanian thinks the us should be organized and I never will. If you want to know how fucking hilariously you've been mislead on items of fact - then we can do that, but you'll have to engage.

Says he's not racist or bigoted.
Attacks a Romanian (not entirely but partly) on the grounds of being a Romanian.

I couldn't make this shit up if you paid me. You're seriously going to lecture ME on how to not be a bigot with that attitude?

I'm not playing these games with you. This is on the same level of "you're not an atheist, you just hate God because you want to sin". Nothing I say can refute your claim because it's an unfalsifiable claim. You just want people to completely agree with your position and you'll accept nothing else.

[The Grand Nudger]

That's about as clear as any response could be. You're not interested in the fact that you've been laundering crises manufactured by great replacement nuts.

They tell you this shit, and you believe that what they say is true. Look, you're in good company, half of white americans also believe the things that white supremacists say are true. The number goes up as you remove items. White genocide is the hard sell, always has been. 1-4 are warmups, it's an academic concern whether 1 through 4 amount to 5, even if the connection isn't explicitly made in the minds of the leaners themselves..that's certainly the intent of the whole bit, regardless. In my experience, people tend to gravitate towards a political white genocide over a biological one, though the recent hilarity with the census made a blip in that.

What word do you think we should use to refer to people like you and them, who believe that the made up shit white supremacists wring their hands over is true? Will using whatever word you prefer change the contents of the referent? Will using whatever word you prefer stop the people it describes from generating ridiculous propaganda? Will using whatever word you prefer stop them from disenfranchising those people they believe are taking over their country, people with no legitimate claim to political office or representation?