Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: March 29, 2024, 12:58 am

Poll: Is zero a natural number?
This poll is closed.
Yes
30.00%
3 30.00%
No
70.00%
7 70.00%
Total 10 vote(s) 100%
* You voted for this item. [Show Results]

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Is zero a natural number?
#31
RE: Is zero a natural number?
The concept of zero as a number is akin to God as an actual "real" entity.
No God, No fear.
Know God, Know fear.
Reply
#32
RE: Is zero a natural number?
Quote:Really, we're going to have a debate over nothing? No thanks.
Wha's wrong can't handle it Smile
"Change was inevitable"


Nemo sicut deus debet esse!

[Image: Canada_Flag.jpg?v=1646203843]



 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
–SHIRLEY CHISHOLM


      
Reply
#33
RE: Is zero a natural number?
(January 19, 2022 at 12:53 am)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Really, we're going to have a debate over nothing? No thanks.

It's like having a debate over who/what created God? Of wait, God has always existed. But, of course, the same cannot be said of the Cosmos??

Theists love explaining one mystery with even greater mysteries and then appeal to their own ignorance to end such conversations, and, so, yes, not much to debate.
Reply
#34
RE: Is zero a natural number?
(January 18, 2022 at 10:33 pm)polymath257 Wrote:
(January 18, 2022 at 9:17 pm)brewer Wrote: Ouch, ouch, ouch, my late high school-early undergrad brain hurts. I expect a delivery of fentanyl and midazolam. Not propofol, no Jackson for me.

Just for fun, does negative or positive ever apply to zero?

Depends a bit on the book used.  One way of resolving ambiguities is as follows:

Positive: >0
Negative: <0
Non-negative: >=0
Non-positive: <=0

So, 0 is not negative, not positive, but is non-negative and non-positive.

Well that's just double talk. Don't even try to tell me about swamp land in Florida. Hehe

I suppose next you'll tell me that infinity exists between 0 and 1.
I don't have an anger problem, I have an idiot problem.
Reply
#35
RE: Is zero a natural number?
(January 19, 2022 at 8:08 am)brewer Wrote:
(January 18, 2022 at 10:33 pm)polymath257 Wrote: Depends a bit on the book used.  One way of resolving ambiguities is as follows:

Positive: >0
Negative: <0
Non-negative: >=0
Non-positive: <=0

So, 0 is not negative, not positive, but is non-negative and non-positive.

Well that's just double talk. Don't even try to tell me about swamp land in Florida. Hehe

I suppose next you'll tell me that infinity exists between 0 and 1.

Between 0 and 1, there exists an infinitude of numbers, some of which are countable (the rational) and others that are not countable (the reals, complex and surreals).
Reply
#36
RE: Is zero a natural number?
(January 19, 2022 at 8:08 am)brewer Wrote:
(January 18, 2022 at 10:33 pm)polymath257 Wrote: Depends a bit on the book used.  One way of resolving ambiguities is as follows:

Positive: >0
Negative: <0
Non-negative: >=0
Non-positive: <=0

So, 0 is not negative, not positive, but is non-negative and non-positive.

Well that's just double talk. Don't even try to tell me about swamp land in Florida. Hehe

I suppose next you'll tell me that infinity exists between 0 and 1.

No, it is precision of language.

There are infinitely many rational numbers between 0 and 1. That is different than infinity being between them.

(January 19, 2022 at 10:25 am)Jehanne Wrote:
(January 19, 2022 at 8:08 am)brewer Wrote: Well that's just double talk. Don't even try to tell me about swamp land in Florida. Hehe

I suppose next you'll tell me that infinity exists between 0 and 1.

Between 0 and 1, there exists an infinitude of numbers, some of which are countable (the rational) and others that are not countable (the reals, complex and surreals).

I would caution: the numbers themselves are not countable or uncountable. The *sets* of those numbers are.

So, a set containing all numbers of the form a+b*sqrt(2) is a countable set even though it has irrational numbers in it.

(January 19, 2022 at 12:53 am)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Really, we're going to have a debate over nothing? No thanks.

Edward Grant has a wonderful book about medieval notions of the vacuum called 'Much Ado About Nothing'. It's an interesting read. You might like it.

(January 18, 2022 at 10:56 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:
(January 18, 2022 at 9:55 pm)Jehanne Wrote: What's the alternative?  That the laws of nature not be describable by some mathematical models?  The term for such a world would be "magic".

As for "nothing" no one has, to my satisfaction, ever provided any physical description of that.  To use "nothing" in a sentence is to give it meaning, if only as an abstraction.  One might as well ask what color Saturday is.

Well...it seems to me that nothingness literally means an absence of physicality.

Why just physicality?
Reply
#37
RE: Is zero a natural number?
Gosh this is fun, and gets funner as time approaches zero.
I don't have an anger problem, I have an idiot problem.
Reply
#38
RE: Is zero a natural number?
As the 5th Beatle would say, ya gotta have something.
Reply
#39
RE: Is zero a natural number?
(January 19, 2022 at 12:18 pm)Ranjr Wrote: As the 5th Beatle would say, ya gotta have something.

Hexadecimal should instead be properly called sexadecimal.
Reply
#40
RE: Is zero a natural number?
(January 19, 2022 at 7:55 pm)Jehanne Wrote:
(January 19, 2022 at 12:18 pm)Ranjr Wrote: As the 5th Beatle would say, ya gotta have something.

Hexadecimal should instead be properly called sexadecimal.

Not to be confused with sexagesimal, which is base 60.
Reply



Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Euclid proved that there are an infinite number of prime numbers. Jehanne 7 890 March 14, 2021 at 8:26 am
Last Post: Gawdzilla Sama
  Graham's Number GrandizerII 15 1828 February 18, 2018 at 4:58 pm
Last Post: GrandizerII
  This number is illegal in the USA Aractus 13 4656 May 7, 2016 at 10:51 pm
Last Post: J a c k
  The Magical Number 9 Rhondazvous 25 5013 December 30, 2015 at 4:47 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Tricky Number Sequence Puzzle GrandizerII 16 5994 January 20, 2015 at 2:35 am
Last Post: Whateverist
Question Dividing by zero Tea Earl Grey Hot 77 21545 January 18, 2015 at 12:31 am
Last Post: GrandizerII
  What is Zero (0)? ManMachine 22 7492 February 9, 2014 at 11:11 am
Last Post: truthBtold
  Number crunching curios pocaracas 24 9192 January 4, 2014 at 2:14 am
Last Post: Belac Enrobso
  If 0.999(etc) = 1, does 1 - 0.999 go to zero? Euler 26 8927 April 30, 2013 at 12:17 pm
Last Post: Mister Agenda
  The nature of number jonb 82 39404 October 28, 2012 at 11:02 pm
Last Post: jonb



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)