Job

[h311inac311]

Reading your own lack of faith and morals into the text?

So what kind of morality are we lacking that you have?

This was more so a response to Happy Skeptic who asserted that Abraham wouldn't have offered up his son as a sacrifice.

You guys have to consider the other side of the coin, if God is real then we are to live our lives with his will in mind. Even when we cannot comprehend his good will. Ultimately, with heaven in view, our suffering here on earth is here today and gone tomorrow.

I find that in our modern world most people don't even begin to consider how their actions will affect the next generation until they are holding a baby in their arms.

But such is the affect that materialism would have, am I not correct?

[The Grand Nudger]

If god is real, I don't care. I'm not gonna kill my son because some disembodied voice tells me to. That's insane. You're sitting here chiding the modern world, materialists, and atheists for their lack of concern with hypothetical baby in arm as you directly excuse legendary calls to infanticide for the most banal and ignorant reason imaginable. I think the effect of killing a kid because a voice told you to, on the next generation, is that kid is dead.

Next.

[polymath257]

So what kind of morality are we lacking that you have?

This was more so a response to Happy Skeptic who asserted that Abraham wouldn't have offered up his son as a sacrifice.

You guys have to consider the other side of the coin, if God is real then we are to live our lives with his will in mind. Even when we cannot comprehend his good will. Ultimately, with heaven in view, our suffering here on earth is here today and gone tomorrow.

I find that in our modern world most people don't even begin to consider how their actions will affect the next generation until they are holding a baby in their arms.

But such is the affect that materialism would have, am I not correct?

If God is real and asks someone to kill their kid, then God has proven him/her/itself to be immoral or amoral. So, no, I would NOT have to live my life with God in mind. A monster like that needs to be fought or lived as far away from as possible.

[polymath257]

Reading your own lack of faith and morals into the text?

Would if an omniscient God knew more than you?

What do you think would happen if an omniscient being, who created the universe, and knows the end from the beginning, sat down with you to have a conversation?
Would if he told you what perfect living actually looked like? Would he blow your mind? Or would you just sit there nodding your head saying "yes, that makes sense to me."?

Imagine you are a parent, let's say you're 100 years old, you've travelled the world, attended many lectures on philosophy and read many books on the subject. Now you have to sit down with a 10 year old and explain everything you know. Would the little boy just nod his head and think, "yeah, this all makes sense to me intuitively."? Or would there be something you could call to his attention that would be shocking?

The teaspoon can't comprehend the ocean.

Blow my mind? Sure. But I would be much more interested in the science a deity could convey as opposed to the 'perfect life'. At the least, I could verify the science is correct by testing. A perfect life isn't even something that I think can exist, let alone be the same for everyone, or dependent on the viewpoint of any entity, even a deity.

But morality isn't like science. it is a matter of opinion and not of fact. So yes, I *can* judge the morality of a deity. Furthermore, I think that doing so is an ethical obligation if you actually believe a deity exists.

A 10 year old would likely listen, maybe ask questions, and maybe eventually come to different conclusions than I did. Those things that are not understood could be relegated to a later date to consider.

[Jehanne]

Reading your own lack of faith and morals into the text?

Would if an omniscient God knew more than you?

What do you think would happen if an omniscient being, who created the universe, and knows the end from the beginning, sat down with you to have a conversation?
Would if he told you what perfect living actually looked like? Would he blow your mind? Or would you just sit there nodding your head saying "yes, that makes sense to me."?

Imagine you are a parent, let's say you're 100 years old, you've travelled the world, attended many lectures on philosophy and read many books on the subject. Now you have to sit down with a 10 year old and explain everything you know. Would the little boy just nod his head and think, "yeah, this all makes sense to me intuitively."? Or would there be something you could call to his attention that would be shocking?

The teaspoon can't comprehend the ocean.

Blow my mind? Sure. But I would be much more interested in the science a deity could convey as opposed to the 'perfect life'. At the least, I could verify the science is correct by testing. A perfect life isn't even something that I think can exist, let alone be the same for everyone, or dependent on the viewpoint of any entity, even a deity.

But morality isn't like science. it is a matter of opinion and not of fact. So yes, I *can* judge the morality of a deity. Furthermore, I think that doing so is an ethical obligation if you actually believe a deity exists.

A 10 year old would likely listen, maybe ask questions, and maybe eventually come to different conclusions than I did. Those things that are not understood could be relegated to a later date to consider.

If you, as a mathematician, were (say for $200) perform an experiment where you toss a half-dollar into the air 100 times, and I, claiming prophetic powers, provided you the exact sequence of heads & tails that you will get in a sealed envelope in advance, would you be impressed by that fact, the $200 notwithstanding?

[Angrboda]

Unless the reasons for a thing are transparent, it's just going to appear as baseless assertion. If they are transparent, one might be amazed but not literally blown away as understanding the thing removes any mystery.

[Jehanne]

Are you "following" me?

[The Grand Nudger]

 Furthermore, I think that doing so is an ethical obligation if you actually believe a deity exists.

Consider the pitch.  Not gods, our lovely friends.  A lollipop in heaven tomorrow if you kill your kid on earth today.  I mean, who wouldn't, amiright?   Any excuse to get rid of the little fuckers.  A gods morality is rarely an improvement on it's people's, but if this is the kind of moral assessor we're dealing with what are the odds his conclusion as to whether or not it might be bad to kill your kid, or bad to arrange such a loyalty test, is "shoe : boxcar : purple"...?

[GUBU]

So what kind of morality are we lacking that you have?

This was more so a response to Happy Skeptic who asserted that Abraham wouldn't have offered up his son as a sacrifice.

You guys have to consider the other side of the coin, if God is real then we are to live our lives with his will in mind. Even when we cannot comprehend his good will. Ultimately, with heaven in view, our suffering here on earth is here today and gone tomorrow.

I find that in our modern world most people don't even begin to consider how their actions will affect the next generation until they are holding a baby in their arms.

But such is the affect that materialism would have, am I not correct?

Yes, I too find that christians are far more likely to be selfish, self absorbed and unconcerned for others.

It is baked into their religion after all.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

So what kind of morality are we lacking that you have?

This was more so a response to Happy Skeptic who asserted that Abraham wouldn't have offered up his son as a sacrifice.

You guys have to consider the other side of the coin, if God is real then we are to live our lives with his will in mind. Even when we cannot comprehend his good will. Ultimately, with heaven in view, our suffering here on earth is here today and gone tomorrow.

I find that in our modern world most people don't even begin to consider how their actions will affect the next generation until they are holding a baby in their arms.

But such is the affect that materialism would have, am I not correct?

You realize that what you're describing is a hostage situation that has deteriorated into Stockholm Syndrome, right?

Boru