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What if Judas didn't do it?
February 16, 2023 at 10:12 pm
Judas is proverbially a bad guy of the NT, so what would have happened if he didn't betray Jesus? Would Jesus' mission be a (bigger) success or would it be a failure?
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: What if Judas didn't do it?
February 16, 2023 at 10:26 pm
That's like asking what if my character Amidio does this instead of doing that.
He doesn't. He didn't. He won't because the characters are set as they have been written.
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RE: What if Judas didn't do it?
February 16, 2023 at 10:50 pm
I recall a Borges short story in which Judas was the actual Man of Sorrows, rejected by world for his rational response to an out of control zealot. The idea's been around a while.
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RE: What if Judas didn't do it?
February 16, 2023 at 11:00 pm
(February 16, 2023 at 10:12 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: Judas is proverbially a bad guy of the NT, so what would have happened if he didn't betray Jesus? Would Jesus' mission be a (bigger) success or would it be a failure?
I was taught that Judas had no purpose but to betray Jesus - it’s what he was put on Earth for. Of course, when you have the audacity to suggest that that was problematic for the whole free will thing, the nun teaching the catechism class gets all cranky.
Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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RE: What if Judas didn't do it?
February 17, 2023 at 10:39 am
(This post was last modified: February 17, 2023 at 10:46 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Indeed. Judas wasn't the bad guy, judas was a part of gods plan. More thematically, judas stands in for all of us (or, more specifically, all of them, the man is literally called judah) - our own hearts betrayal presaging the outward betrayal of others, and the remorse it engenders in us all. Factually speaking, though, the whole storyline is obvious fiction. Work it out in your head. There's this belligerant out there in public every day making trouble for rome. Everybody knew about it, even the locals hated his guts...and he's not hiding ...so they could pluck him anytime they wanted to. ......but they needed some rando to find him in a made-for-a-tv-movie scene that just also happens to be yet another opportunity for the demigod to comment on his worldview to the viewer?
No. It's a pretty straightforward retelling of exactly the same thing that every "prophet" of the ot was always droning on about as they got rolled by empire after empire aiming through them at each other. Judah has betrayed it's god to the foreigners.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What if Judas didn't do it?
February 17, 2023 at 11:35 am
(February 16, 2023 at 10:12 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: Judas is proverbially a bad guy of the NT, so what would have happened if he didn't betray Jesus? Would Jesus' mission be a (bigger) success or would it be a failure?
We probably wouldn't know his name.
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RE: What if Judas didn't do it?
February 17, 2023 at 11:54 am
We don't, even in the hypothetical, because it isn't his name. The utterance "judas betrayed jesus" is just another way to say "the jews betrayed jesus".
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What if Judas didn't do it?
February 17, 2023 at 12:24 pm
(February 16, 2023 at 10:12 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: Judas is proverbially a bad guy of the NT, so what would have happened if he didn't betray Jesus? Would Jesus' mission be a (bigger) success or would it be a failure?
Jesus was on a suicide mission.
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RE: What if Judas didn't do it?
February 17, 2023 at 12:40 pm
If Judas didn't do it, someone else would have been tasked with the job. Otherwise the whole story would fall apart.
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RE: What if Judas didn't do it?
February 17, 2023 at 1:00 pm
My issue with the Judas fable is the price. Depending on the exact coin used, Judas got paid about $8000.00. Seems kinda low.
I think that if I was going to betray the son of God, I’d hold out for at least a principality.
Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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