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"Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
#11
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
What is the self?
[Image: extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg]
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#12
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
I think it should be noted people who glorify ultraism probably do so out of the non-altruistic motivation of hoping to profit from the sacrifice of others.
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#13
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
Half of our daily consumption of cat food goes to feed whomever shows up for the daily offerings.
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#14
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
Doing good feels good. It's almost amazing how shitty we act en masse considering how good it feels to do good.

https://www.lynn.edu/news/2017/why-doing...themselves.

Of course, that feeling is a benefit.
I'm not anti-Christian. I'm anti-stupid.
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#15
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
(April 9, 2023 at 10:33 pm)Belacqua Wrote:
(April 9, 2023 at 2:27 pm)WinterHold Wrote: One essential question is the following: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?

By interest I mean warmth and love (love  son/daughter so she love you back), give money to employee (so they work hard), give pleasure to a mate (so she/he pleasures you back....

Read

It's probably impossible to eliminate some level of self-interest in any good thing we do. 

Even if there is no reward in money or in publicity. Or in direct pay-back. We still reward ourselves by telling ourselves that we have done a good thing. 

~ I did a good thing.
~ I have a good character because I do things like this.
~ I am a good person.
~ I am better than those who don't do things like this. 


I mean, if you've done a good thing, you obviously have a right to feel pleased by that. But that's still a form of reward.

If you didn’t have 50% of the membership on ignore, you’d know that’s bollocks.

Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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#16
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
(April 9, 2023 at 6:02 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:
(April 9, 2023 at 5:36 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: Maybe everything is. You say that holding a door for someone or giving money to a homeless person has no personal benefit for "you", but even these things are seen as transactional because a person holding a door or giving money does expect it to be paid back somehow by someone when they need it one day. They hope that their good deeds will be remembered by society.

I don’t. For me, things like that are reflex actions. 

Boru

It may be reflex now, but it got that way because it was nurtured.  Why was it nurtured?
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#17
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
(April 9, 2023 at 2:27 pm)WinterHold Wrote: One essential question is the following: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?

By interest I mean warmth and love (love  son/daughter so she love you back), give money to employee (so they work hard), give pleasure to a mate (so she/he pleasures you back....

Read

Not all actions.   Some may be based on pre-wired reaction.

But for those actions which results directly or indirectly from cognative decision making,  I think it is possible to trace the decision to internal perceptions of self-interest.   

Note internal perception of self-interest is not the same thing as common benchmarks used in external analytical evaluation of self-interest.
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#18
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
I think that the notion of disinterested volition is incoherent - which will lead to all sorts of trouble without a doubt.

However, within the context of the question, I'd say no. The full set of interested act is not exhausted by the subsets of transactional relationships or self interested acts or both combined. Consider a situation in life (if you can) where you decided on some course of action that you neither expected anything in return for, or in fact expected a negative return for. Something...perhaps.... that you did not want to do, but felt compelled to do. This subset evades not only transactional relationships, but self interest as well.

Self interest and transaction are, ultimately, easy to resolve in singular fields. They're not dilemmas. That we spend a great deal of our life running essentially on autopilot in a thick soup of such circumstances is only interesting in the confluence and conflicts between them. In the presentation of more complex decision fields. The type of decision field our most pernicious dilemmas occupy is a subset of all fields itself - the exclusively suboptimal. Where all possible resolutions to a given x are negatively weighted...where no single explanation for a given decision can satisfy. Otherwise, there'd be no underlying dilemma or conflict to explain in the first place, eh?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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#19
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
(April 10, 2023 at 1:24 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: I think that the notion of disinterested volition is incoherent - which will lead to all sorts of trouble without a doubt.

However, within the context of the question, I'd say no.  The full set of interested act is not exhausted by the subsets of transactional relationships or self interested acts or both combined.  Consider a situation in life (if you can) where you decided on some course of action that you neither expected anything in return for, or in fact expected a negative return for.  Something...perhaps.... that you did not want to do, but felt compelled to do.  This subset evades not only transactional relationships, but self interest as well.  

Self interest and transaction are, ultimately, easy to resolve in singular fields.  They're not dilemmas.  That we spend a great deal of our life running essentially on autopilot in a thick soup of such circumstances is only interesting in the confluence and conflicts between them.  In the presentation of more complex decision fields.  The type of decision field our most pernicious dilemmas occupy is a subset of all fields itself - the exclusively suboptimal.  Where all possible resolutions to a given x are negatively weighted...where no single explanation for a given decision can satisfy.  Otherwise, there'd be no underlying dilemma or conflict to explain in the first place, eh?

I challenge the contention that you would be motivated to make a decision on a course of action at all if you truly expect no return of any sort from it.
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#20
RE: "Are all actions in life based on interest only"?
Challenge away, I may in fact be the most self interested person in the world. Utterly incapable of doing anything -other- than return seeking. That would not address the conceptual set of possible actions and motivations that are not valid members of that subset.

Ultimately, if a person can't even imagine a counterfactual to return seeking..then they've failed at logic..but more importantly..at life. Wink
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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