Jesus' resurrection was prophesized?

[Paleophyte]

Those who saw the resurrected Jesus, saw prophecy fulfilled.

Which was largely the problem. According to even the church accounts, this resurrected Jesus never appeared to much of anybody except for a handful of the faithful. He could have done his career wonders by showing up to improv night in Jerusalem. That agrees well with a resurrection tale that was invented long after the fact, but poorly with an actual resurrection. If that happened today, people would be going out of their minds, and you have to keep in mind just how much more superstitious people were back then. The Roman Senate didn't meet if the auspices were unfavorable. Having somebody come back from the dead with a wound that Doubting Thomas could fondle simply isn't the sort of event that escapes notice. The muted reaction of the apostles that's pretty much just "Oh, hey, looks like Jesus is back. Cool beans." reads exactly like a poorly constructed narrative. Your difficulty is that nobody saw the resurrected Jesus and it shows.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Firstly, the earliest church were Jews.

Secondly, far from remotely defensive about prophetic fulfilment, the Jewish apostles were putting it right out there front and centre.
Whether it’s Peter (Acts 2) Philip working the Suffering Servant (Acts 8), Paul “proving it was necessary for the Messiah to suffer and rise from the dead”, the Christmas story in Luke, Jesus referencing Daniel...Christians have been very clear that Jesus was what happens when prophecy turns out to be true.

Thirdly, God made promises to Abraham; they were now fulfilled. God had promised to bless humanity through Abraham’s descendants. That had happened. God had promised to end the rule of death. That had now happened. God promised to return to Israel. That had happened. And so on.

Those who saw the resurrected Jesus, saw prophecy fulfilled.

Given how long after the purported events the Gospels and the Epistles were written, ‘cooking the books’ is a valid criticism.

Boru

[The Grand Nudger]

The minute you start your apologia in acts the entire thing is doomed.

[awty]

These prophesies...what's up with the second coming date moving on the regular?

Makes me doubt other so-called prophecies.

[Mister Agenda]

Those who saw the resurrected Jesus, saw prophecy fulfilled.

Which was largely the problem. According to even the church accounts, this resurrected Jesus never appeared to much of anybody except for a handful of the faithful. He could have done his career wonders by showing up to improv night in Jerusalem. That agrees well with a resurrection tale that was invented long after the fact, but poorly with an actual resurrection. If that happened today, people would be going out of their minds, and you have to keep in mind just how much more superstitious people were back then. The Roman Senate didn't meet if the auspices were unfavorable. Having somebody come back from the dead with a wound that Doubting Thomas could fondle simply isn't the sort of event that escapes notice. The muted reaction of the apostles that's pretty much just "Oh, hey, looks like Jesus is back. Cool beans." reads exactly like a poorly constructed narrative. Your difficulty is that nobody saw the resurrected Jesus and it shows.

And half the time when they were purported to see him, they didn't recognize him.

13 Now that same day two of them were going to a village called Emmaus, about seven miles[a] from Jerusalem. 14 They were talking with each other about everything that had happened. 15 As they talked and discussed these things with each other, Jesus himself came up and walked along with them; 16 but they were kept from recognizing him.

[The Grand Nudger]

Different proto christian groups were looking for different things. As a story from what would one day become the main line community about why all of the other communities didn't recognize jesus, or recognize jesus the specific way they did, that's pretty clever.

I'm always struck in these conversations how vapid the committed contemporary nutter version of magic book is. Like...I thought we were supposed to be the ones shitting on scriptures?

[Paleophyte]

16 but they were kept from recognizing him.

[Vicki Q]

We seem to have moved on from how the resurrection fulfilled prophecy, which is a pity because I had a long “It’s the narrative, not proof texts” speech lined up. Oh, well.

These prophesies...what's up with the second coming date moving on the regular?
Makes me doubt other so-called prophecies.

The longer it gets left, the more people get to be part of the resurrection on the shiny new earth. Given that, I’m good with a delay of any length, frankly.

Given how long after the purported events the Gospels and the Epistles were written, ‘cooking the books’ is a valid criticism.
Boru

?? Twenty years in the case of 1 Corinthians 15?? Not sure what your point is, unless you’re going to totally ignore the diamond hard academic consensus on dating 1 Corinthians, in which case I’m out.

He could have done his career wonders by showing up to improv night in Jerusalem…<snip>... Your difficulty is that nobody saw the resurrected Jesus and it shows.

You need to think BIG here. If it’s unstoppable belief you want to produce, why not go for ever changing writing in the sky, a whole posse of angels surrounding us, miracles on tap and a constant stream of pictures of Jesus in our food?

It’s almost as if God wanted there to be a role for faith.

According to even the church accounts, this resurrected Jesus never appeared to much of anybody except for a handful of the faithful.

“After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep.”

You must have really big hands.

[Fake Messiah]

We seem to have moved on from how the resurrection fulfilled prophecy, which is a pity

You already explained how you see it: you admitted that the OT didn't predict Jesus's resurrection, but that when it supposedly happened, some people looked into OT and found a few lines that they considered were the prophecy.

“After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep.”

Let's put it this way: Bible is not the evidence that anything it claims happened. And when it comes to 500 witnesses, it's only a claim, and what makes it even more shakier is that it's not repeated in any of the Gospels which were written later. So it was probably an interpolation.

[Paleophyte]

We seem to have moved on from how the resurrection fulfilled prophecy, which is a pity because I had a long “It’s the narrative, not proof texts” speech lined up. Oh, well.

Yeah, because what really convinces atheists is storytelling style.

You need to think BIG here. If it’s unstoppable belief you want to produce, why not go for ever changing writing in the sky, a whole posse of angels surrounding us, miracles on tap and a constant stream of pictures of Jesus in our food?

Silly me for expecting miraculous miracles.

It’s almost as if God wanted there to be a role for faith.

For those of you who look for suspension of disbelief in your deity. For the rest of us, it just highlights the incurably gullible.