https://youtu.be/NwdJj8InkNc

(September 16, 2015 at 9:22 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote: Lee was a "lower-case-letter" abolitionist, in that he thought it was morally reprehensible, but not an upper-case Abolitionist, as in, part of organized opposition to the practice. Nevertheless, he made his opposition known, which was no small thing for a professional military officer from the Deep South.

Okay... you asked for it!

We are originally French peasants who fled the fighting around La Rochelle on the central-west Atlantic coast of France, in 1604, and formed one of the first communities on the east coast, at the same time Jamestown was being founded. "Cajun" comes from an Americanized pronunciation of "L'Acadienne" (lah-kah-djinn), meaning "an Acadian", from Acadia (Anglicized), or as we called it, Acadie. We had peaceful and prosperous cordial relations with the native tribe, so "Acadie" was our adoption of the Mi'kmaq natives' name for the area where we settled, starting in 1604, in what would become the Canadian province of Nova Scotia after the Brits took it over (mainly for its excellent naval harbor at Halifax). We lived there as peaceful farmers and ranchers, going back and forth between French and British rulership (and wanting nothing to do with either... we left feudal France for a reason!) despite assimilation attempts by both nations, until the Seven Years War began to brew up, in 1755. The Brits tried one last time to get us to violate our policy of peaceful neutrality, and then tricked us into coming in for a vote at each town's church, where they locked the doors and then deported each town's population onto prison ships, where disease in the squalid living conditions killed many of us, and the rickety old prison ships would often sink in the passage to whatever distant colony they tried shipping us off to.

We call this Le Grand Dérangement. As a result, thousands died; thousands more were deported and scattered, destroying a community that had persisted in peace for 150 years. Finally, a leader among us (whom I can count as my direct ancestor) Joseph Broussard dit Beausoleil, managed to round up most of the groups that had managed to stay together, and got permission from Spain (who then owned Louisiana) for us to settle in that colony. When the Spanish tried to get/force us to fight against the British-Americans, we retreated into the swamplands we call the Bayous, and forged our unique culture into a new one (most "Cajun" foods come about from our use of French cooking techniques with Native American recipes and spices). We managed to resist assimilation, and remained Catholic, poor, and dedicated to the principles of peace and the equality of all peoples.

The Creoles, on the other hand, vary in race, and are frequently of mixed racial heritage (in fact, the word creole means "a mixture"), being made up of the various cultures that blended in the French colonial islands of the Caribbean, and who were the predominant landowners in the busy port of New Orleans, Louisiana, especially after they took it over from the Spanish. Their culture wound up being very similar to the Cajun culture, in Louisiana, but it has more Afro-Caribbean roots than ours does, and both the cuisine and their version of French reflects the difference. It is considered deeply insulting to call a Cajun a Creole because of the divide between their landowning wealth and our refugee poverty, stemming back to the way we felt they treated us upon arrival in Louisiana. Ironically, the roles were somewhat reversed after the United States purchased Louisiana, and suddenly the dark-skinned Creoles were largely stripped of their wealth and social position. We Cajuns had no part in that, and wanted no part, and so we became even more isolated, as much as we could... even in 1972, when my mother introduced my father to her father, he referred to my dad as "The American".

My particular family went even further than the rest of the Cajuns did, in reaction to the racist society they felt imposed on their idealism, and moved past the swamps into the marshy flatlands of southwestern Louisiana, where they live to this day, near Lake Arthur, Crowley, Jennings, and Lake Charles. Other than myself, my mother is the "northernmost" of the family, a profesor at LSU-Alexandria, in the dead center of the state.

If you are interested in learning more about our history, click here. Or here.

Edited to Add: The Wiki article gets a few things wrong, such as the reason it was called Acadie, claiming it's related to the Greek "Arcadia". But it's still a decent summary, and I'm sure everyone here has GoogleFu skills at least as good as my own.

What a fascinating history. For people to go through so much and still have a sense of “We.”

That’s interesting that the Creoles did not treat the Cajuns well. I guess it’s true that power corrupts because those in power know their power is tenuous. I was reading in “Spirits of the Passage” how North Africans enslaved European sailors who got lost in the Mediterranean Sea. Everyone on this planet has been the slave of someone at some point in history. Even the English were reduced to serfdom by William the Conqueror.

The root of “reparations” is “repair.” I come to a place like AF and I see people working towards repairing our world. But the larger society? Well, like Fred Pohl said, “Those who know, don’t count and those who count, don’t care.”

(September 16, 2015 at 11:29 pm)BrokenQuill92 Wrote: http://youtu.be/UO1PcovTk90

I understand what she’s saying. I never felt comfortable with the word “color-blind.” It sounds like a code work for business as usual but pretend like it doesn’t exist. I don’t feel accepted by people who can only look at me with their eyes closed. Knowamsane?

(September 16, 2015 at 9:08 pm)Dystopia Wrote: I think is enhanced by confirmation bias and the tendency to prefer those who look like us. Most marriages are between people of the same race and social/economic class - Meaning that if you're white and middle class, you're more likely to marry a white middle class person - Particularly because most people we grow up with are also part of the same social class and share the same culture, therefore we feel compelled and attracted by them. I think race certainly doesn't exist scientifically, but neither do countries but it's still a useful concept in our everyday lives. What separates races the most is culture and culture is probably the strongest cause of racism - I.E. The reason why whites thought blacks were inferior wasn't just beacuse they were darker, but because of how they organized and acted/behaved. It's curious to see how racial dynamics may vary - My girlfriend is part gypsy and she fucking hates gypsies because she despises the culture.

If we are going to use race as a useful social construct to discuss power dynamics, sovereignty of territories, etc, we might as well admit that white people are a race as well, just like black people, and we are divided into sub-groups as well (i.e. Spanish and Italians are darker than Brits and Germans, but it also depends on the person).

I think this is true of most people about marrying within one's own culture, or at least in a familiarity with what you were raised in.

White people are a race if black people are. we're just not used to being told that because white people all get to be individuals rather than being seen as a homogeneous collective, like every other group.

(September 17, 2015 at 12:51 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote: 4. Prison Industrial Complex. When Minorities are taken out of their neighborhoods and put in prisons in White neighborhoods, the Minority neighborhood is not allowed to count the incarcerated individual in the census as a resident, but the White neighborhood is. This means the White neighborhood gets to use the body of this politically dead person for congressional representation and government funding.

Quite so. Another "must read" author, if you have not yet done so, is James W. Loewen, whose Lies My Teacher Told Me is one of the most important books I have ever read (he's a history professor, and he examines the six main high school textbooks for the ways in which they whitewash what actually happened in American history, by comparing what the books say to what the primary literature says, mainly on subjects of our genocide of the Native Americans and our treatment of African Americans throughout our history).

But in this case, your subject is something he talks about in Sundown Towns: A Hidden Dimension of American Racism, and as horrifying as our "sundown town" history (which continues, as he documents) was to read about, it made my skin crawl (I was in a prison when I read it) to learn that the rural counties in which my prisons were always located could count the minority population in the prison as part of their census, while paying nothing to them, for purposes of federal funding and other programs, even for avoiding being penalized for being racial exclusion zones.

(September 17, 2015 at 7:50 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote: Quite so. Another "must read" author, if you have not yet done so, is James W. Loewen, whose Lies My Teacher Told Me is one of the most important books I have ever read (he's a history professor, and he examines the six main high school textbooks for the ways in which they whitewash what actually happened in American history, by comparing what the books say to what the primary literature says, mainly on subjects of our genocide of the Native Americans and our treatment of African Americans throughout our history).

But in this case, your subject is something he talks about in Sundown Towns: A Hidden Dimension of American Racism, and as horrifying as our "sundown town" history (which continues, as he documents) was to read about, it made my skin crawl (I was in a prison when I read it) to learn that the rural counties in which my prisons were always located could count the minority population in the prison as part of their census, while paying nothing to them, for purposes of federal funding and other programs, even for avoiding being penalized for being racial exclusion zones.

I was in luck and able to download audio versions of both books. so I will be able to read them along with the 0Diamond books. Did you see my replay to your post before where you mentioned Jared Diamond?

I think if we focus on specifics like this it will open the door to public discourse of what really concerns us more than if we just say we want to talk about racism. I imagine White people see that the same way a man might react if his woman just comes in out of the blue and says, "We need to talk about our relationship." He doesn't know where this conversation will go, what the rules are or what is expected of him. All he knows is his woman is uhappy and it is somehow his fault. But specific, undeniable conditions of racial inequality are something people can talk about with a view to resolution. Knowamsnae?

(September 18, 2015 at 11:18 am)Rhondazvous Wrote: I was in luck and able to download audio versions of both books. so I will be able to read them along with the 0Diamond books. Did you see my replay to your post before where you mentioned Jared Diamond?

I think if we focus on specifics like this it will open the door to public discourse of what really concerns us more than if we just say we want to talk about racism. I imagine White people see that the same way a man might react if his woman just comes in out of the blue and says,  "We need to talk about our relationship." He doesn't know where this conversation will go, what the rules are or what is expected of him. All he knows is his woman is uhappy and it is somehow his fault. But specific, undeniable conditions of racial inequality are something people can talk about with a view to resolution. Knowamsnae?

Yes, that's why I recommended the new books to you. I grew up with no TV and so learned to be a reader. I like readers. Just be prepared for both Diamond and Loewen to blow your freakin' mind. They know some stuff, and it's Not Good™. What upset me wasn't just what I learned, but that I didn't know it, and I can't figure out why it's not common knowledge and part of the standard curricula.

You have an excellent point about the feeling of ambush, but I also think there's a huge degree of blindness (when people say "I am color blind", I think, "no, you're just blind") going on, as well, which on some level the average Joe Whitey is aware exists, and it terrifies him to think today might be the day he's called out and can no longer think of himself as a Good Person via the colorblindness self-delusion.

The good news is that the reason Average Joe Whitey gets so nervous about it is that he associates "racist" with "really bad person", and he doesn't want to be that. That's the fundamental difference between him and his father/grandfather's generation, and it's actually a massive sign of progress, even if it does hamper efforts to repair the damage that the grandparents' generation (and those before it) did through systematic white supremacy. What I try to emphasize for them is that if they're unwilling to discuss the lingering effects of the legacy of white supremacist policies that drove this nation (and especially the state gov'ts), then they're part of the problem, no matter how they feel about other races personally.

(September 18, 2015 at 1:20 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote: Yes, that's why I recommended the new books to you. I grew up with no TV and so learned to be a reader. I like readers. Just be prepared for both Diamond and Loewen to blow your freakin' mind. They know some stuff, and it's Not Good™. What upset me wasn't just what I learned, but that I didn't know it, and I can't figure out why it's not common knowledge and part of the standard curricula.

You have an excellent point about the feeling of ambush, but I also think there's a huge degree of blindness (when people say "I am color blind", I think, "no, you're just blind") going on, as well, which on some level the average Joe Whitey is aware exists, and it terrifies him to think today might be the day he's called out and can no longer think of himself as a Good Person via the colorblindness self-delusion.

The good news is that the reason Average Joe Whitey gets so nervous about it is that he associates "racist" with "really bad person", and he doesn't want to be that. That's the fundamental difference between him and his father/grandfather's generation, and it's actually a massive sign of progress, even if it does hamper efforts to repair the damage that the grandparents' generation (and those before it) did through systematic white supremacy. What I try to emphasize for them is that if they're unwilling to discuss the lingering effects of the legacy of white supremacist policies that drove this nation (and especially the state gov'ts), then they're part of the problem, no matter how they feel about other races personally.

I will start on the first Diamond book tonight. From what you say, I should probably be sitting down, make sure my bladder is empty and there are no sharp objects within my immediate vicinity.

What you’re saying is so on point. I’ve often wondered why Whites deny being racist by claiming they treat other Whites just as bady as they treat Blacks. “Oh, I’m not racist. I do that to everyone.” It’s like it’s better to be an equal opportunity asshole than a racist. You pinpoint an answer to the question of why it has become such a horrible thing to be seen as a racist.

I’ve also been told that every generation of White people fears that it will be the generation on which god visits the sins or their fathers. Yet they can’t stop because they’re sitting on the tiger’s back and they know the tiger is not just going to let them get down and walk peacefully away.

And you are right, color-blindness is not helping repair the damage. But, as a species, we are making progress.

You love to read? Well, I am a writer and I love readers, too. I’ve Witten 3 books (2 novels and an autobiography).

(September 18, 2015 at 3:53 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote:

(September 18, 2015 at 1:20 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote: Yes, that's why I recommended the new books to you. I grew up with no TV and so learned to be a reader. I like readers. Just be prepared for both Diamond and Loewen to blow your freakin' mind. They know some stuff, and it's Not Good™. What upset me wasn't just what I learned, but that I didn't know it, and I can't figure out why it's not common knowledge and part of the standard curricula.

You have an excellent point about the feeling of ambush, but I also think there's a huge degree of blindness (when people say "I am color blind", I think, "no, you're just blind") going on, as well, which on some level the average Joe Whitey is aware exists, and it terrifies him to think today might be the day he's called out and can no longer think of himself as a Good Person via the colorblindness self-delusion.

The good news is that the reason Average Joe Whitey gets so nervous about it is that he associates "racist" with "really bad person", and he doesn't want to be that. That's the fundamental difference between him and his father/grandfather's generation, and it's actually a massive sign of progress, even if it does hamper efforts to repair the damage that the grandparents' generation (and those before it) did through systematic white supremacy. What I try to emphasize for them is that if they're unwilling to discuss the lingering effects of the legacy of white supremacist policies that drove this nation (and especially the state gov'ts), then they're part of the problem, no matter how they feel about other races personally.

I will start on the first Diamond book tonight. From what you say, I should probably be sitting down, make sure my bladder is empty and there are no sharp objects within my immediate vicinity.

What you’re saying is so on point. I’ve often wondered why Whites deny being racist by claiming they treat other Whites just as bady as they treat Blacks. “Oh, I’m not racist. I do that to everyone.” It’s like it’s better to be an  equal opportunity asshole than a racist.   You pinpoint an answer to the question of why it has become such a horrible thing to be seen as a racist.

I’ve also been told that every generation of White people fears that it will be the generation on which god visits the sins or their fathers. Yet they can’t stop because they’re sitting on the tiger’s back and they know the tiger is not just going to let them get down and walk peacefully away.  

And you are right, color-blindness is not helping repair the damage. But, as a species,  we are making progress.  

You love to read? Well, I am a writer and I love readers, too. I’ve Witten 3 books (2 novels and an autobiography).

Normally, I would inquire into your authored books for the purpose of reading, but I just spent 9 years of my life doing little but reading, so I'm kind of on a book vacation for at least the next several months.

(September 18, 2015 at 4:44 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote: Normally, I would inquire into your authored books for the purpose of reading, but I just spent 9 years of my life doing little but reading, so I'm kind of on a book vacation for at least the next several months.

As long as you're not on a cerebral vacation, s'all one to me.