So God has time to sort you out a band but when it comes to starving children, flood victims or contageious disease he's conspiciously absent, huh?

It's called conformation bias tack.

Tacky....you can't fucking be serious.

theVOID Wrote:So God has time to sort you out a band but when it comes to starving children, flood victims or contageious disease he's conspiciously absent, huh?

It's called conformation bias tack.

Furthermore, the placebo effect as a therapeutic self-fulfilling prophecy has been measured. Which explains why prayer can't seem to work for truly big problems, they're too big for the placebo effect to deal with.

tackattack Wrote:For instnace 4 weeks ago we had no music at our service in our new church because no one knew how to play insturments. The worship team and I prayed for God to provide someone who could play music before servicestarted. After service we had a little luncheon and we invited some of the new faces in to eat with us. One of them played guitar and volunteered without being asked to play for our services. Next week we enjoyed the guitarbut after service the worship team and I prayed that we could find someone to use the keyboard that we had. The following week's service we had a new face who spoke to Sue about wanting to play the keyboard for us. Isn't that tangible and measurable? When we prayed over my son that his pain would stop and he wouldn't have any more pain when he lost his fingernail and it happened was that psychosomatic reasoning for an 8 year old? I know it's going to get written off as coincidence or some other excuse, but yoou can't say it's immeasurable or not "real". I'm sure you'll try though.

So "God" provided you with a band and he stopped the pain caused by a missing fingernail in your 8 year old son.

Since he obviously responds to your relatively trivial requests, why don't you ask him to provide clean drinking water to parts of the world that lack it? Come on! If he acts to provide you with a band, surely he'll respond to a request that will improve the lives of millions!

And since he stopped the pain from a missing fingernail in your child, why don't you ask this deity to stop the pain experienced by all the children in the world who have cancer? Surely, if he'll act to stop pain caused by a minor thing lika a missing fingernail, he'll respond to your request to end serious pain and suffering that would allow tens of thousands of children to enjoy life (not to mention make their parents joyous).

So I expect you to pray for these things (after all, why wouldn't you?). And I expect that I'll see news stories very shortly telling us about the miraculous discovery of clean drinking water all over the world, and how child cancer wards are rapidly emptying because the disease is suddenly and inexplicably disappearing.

But we both know these things will not happen despite how hard and sincerely you pray. And you'll have some excuse such as "prayer doesn't work that way". But then you try to sell us some silly story about how "God" provided your church with a band or your kid's minor pain was relieved. Either your deity answers prayers or he doesn't. Why would he answer a plea for something as trivial as a band while prayers for starving children are ignored?

Well Tack you said they would and they did, sad they do not understand how God cares for the ones who want to worship Him. You guys want God to just whiske away the problems of the world,why, so you can believe, it just does not work that way. If you want results from your employer do you think its going to come because you ask him/her, or will the results come when you have shown your loyalty to said employer. May be that God is waiting on a large group of people that are loyal to Him to ask that He help people to find clean drinking water, so why don't you guys join in on the asking if you are so concerned about others. By the way what are you all doing to help those who need clean drinking water. I know that God has sent many people into the mission field to help with that very thing, maybe you guys need to go on a mission trip and see how others are doing Gods work with those who are in need. God's church provides more aide to the third world countries than you will ever know. God has said that He will work through mankind to help man, He wants us to be responsible partners with Him. We are responsible for the mess the worlds in why is it that you think God should come behind us and clean up our mess, is that what your parents did for you, I think that you guys need to see the world and its problems for what they are and quit blaming God whom you do not believe in for this mess we made.

Hey, G-C..when you invent your own 'god' he's like a sock puppet. He does and says whatever you want him to because...duh...it's your hand doing the moving.

For the umpteenth time, if you wish to delude yourself with visions of your sky-daddy go right ahead but don't expect not to catch a load of shit for it when you parade such flaming insanity on an atheist message board.

You know min I'm very serious.

Confimation bias to the extent that it warps reality is pretty strong and I'm fairly certain of my hold on what's real and what's not. The placebo effect is far more poiniant response to answered prayers. I don't selectively choose to attribute the good to God and the Bad to Satan, so I don't see where confirmation bias plays more than a menial part (ie. the subjectiveness of experience). I rarely ask God for anything that I can work on myself. If I were a more faithful servant I'd rely on God for everything. Check out anything about George Müller, I'll see if I can scan in my little booklet and upload it somewhere for a quick little read if anyone's interested.

Saying God has answered my prayers is in no way flaming insanity, but you're entitled to your opinion, as I am mine. I didn't say God would answer your prayer, or selfish prayers or doesn't allow for trials and tribulation in our lives.

(January 14, 2011 at 1:56 am)tackattack Wrote: OK min I'll give you this it's either all bullshit or all correct, guess which one I think it is

For instnace 4 weeks ago we had no music at our service in our new church because no one knew how to play insturments. The worship team and I prayed for God to provide someone who could play music before servicestarted. After service we had a little luncheon and we invited some of the new faces in to eat with us. One of them played guitar and volunteered without being asked to play for our services. Next week we enjoyed the guitarbut after service the worship team and I prayed that we could find someone to use the keyboard that we had. The following week's service we had a new face who spoke to Sue about wanting to play the keyboard for us. Isn't that tangible and measurable? When we prayed over my son that his pain would stop and he wouldn't have any more pain when he lost his fingernail and it happened was that psychosomatic reasoning for an 8 year old? I know it's going to get written off as coincidence or some other excuse, but yoou can't say it's immeasurable or not "real". I'm sure you'll try though.

.......
Now im not that good at math, but, im guessing that the probability that when someone new enters a group, he brings with him skills or new information of some sort, like irish cooking, dogbreeding or...PLAYING THE GOD DAMN GUITAR! Do you have any idea how many guitarplayers there are around the world, or people that can use the guitar? I would guess...millions.

Coincidence as an excure? Never heard that one before. You just cant accept that your not special, there's no plan for you, nothing.

(January 14, 2011 at 10:55 pm)Godschild Wrote: Well Tack you said they would and they did, sad they do not understand how God cares for the ones who want to worship Him.

I find the logic hard to follow that anyone who worships god will have their prayers answered when so many deserving people, who live good lives and help others, end up being SHIT ON...and when they pray...NOTHING. And it gets explained away as "This is god's plan for you," or "You must have secretly deserved that."

(January 14, 2011 at 10:55 pm)Godschild Wrote: You guys want God to just whiske away the problems of the world,why, so you can believe, it just does not work that way.

No, I don't want god to get rid of all the problems in the world just to give me peace of mind about his existence. I want him to get rid of the horrible diseases and genocides and starvation because I have empathy for the rest of the human race.

(January 14, 2011 at 10:55 pm)Godschild Wrote: If you want results from your employer do you think its going to come because you ask him/her, or will the results come when you have shown your loyalty to said employer.

I admit to being too lazy to go back and look, but didn't he ask about FUTURE employers? More specifically, guidance about where to go? That has nothing to do with loyalty, but rather a hint of the best direction to place one's efforts. You know, "Hey God, I know you're supposed to have some sort of plan for me, so to save myself a lot of wasted effort and floundering around, how about you give me a quick sign as to where you're thinkin' I'm most useful?" It doesn't matter, you kept avoiding the question.

(January 14, 2011 at 10:55 pm)Godschild Wrote: May be that God is waiting on a large group of people that are loyal to Him to ask that He help people to find clean drinking water, so why don't you guys join in on the asking if you are so concerned about others.

Dear Godschild, that was the most asshole statement I have heard come out of your mouth so far. I guess the size of the populations that need the clean water isn't big enough. I guess the size of the people who prayed for it thus far wasn't enough. Didn't Abraham argue God down to having what...only 10 people out of the two cities and he wouldn't destroy them? 10 people vs millions. God damn. Next time I get caught by the cops for something, I'm so calling on Abraham. He must be a lawyer/negotiator without peer.

(January 14, 2011 at 10:55 pm)Godschild Wrote: By the way what are you all doing to help those who need clean drinking water.

Don't turn this back on the questioner to avoid answering it.

(January 14, 2011 at 10:55 pm)Godschild Wrote: We are responsible for the mess the worlds in why is it that you think God should come behind us and clean up our mess, is that what your parents did for you, I think that you guys need to see the world and its problems for what they are and quit blaming God whom you do not believe in for this mess we made.

Ebola is OUR invention? Weather phenomena? Get a grip.

Quote:You know min I'm very serious.

I'm sure you are tacky. Serious...but still delusional.

Really. You concocted a 'god' who created the whole fucking universe ( apparently for shits and giggles ) in the blink of an eye but you then think he gives a rat's ass if you have a guitar player?

Really???

You make him sound like a low-grade talent agent looking for his 10%.