Islam wasn't this bad in the start. I think because people did not take it as literally as they did now.

After Muhammad died and after some conflict, his youngest wife(Aycha, you know the one he married when she was 6) Raised an entire army and started a military campaign which was successful to some extent. If back then people truly followed the teachings that said women are of half minds and faiths no one would have taken her seriously enough to march with her to battle...

There was also a time in the Muslim empire when Caliph Omar famously said "spread wheat on top of the mountain, so it would not be said birds went hungry in the lands of Muslims" What the hell happened since then?

Faith could be fine in a small dose, kind of like weed, read about heaven, take the no alcohol as a parental advice etc... but taking it too literally is bring bad things on everyone's head.

(January 11, 2016 at 10:45 am)drfuzzy Wrote:

(January 11, 2016 at 2:17 am)Sheed1980 Wrote: So God gives us all as His creatures a chance to accept Him as the only Lord of the universe. So are u going to do it now in this life, worship Him alone and be rewarded with whatever u desire in the Hereafter for obeying and pleasing our creator, or will u ignore His guidance and forgiveness, disbelieve in Him, and then accept Him as ur Lord when it's too late to repent and u r doomed to eternal punishment, like none that you have ever seen? I guarantee u will accept Him as ur Lord willingly in this life or willingly in the Hereafter. But my advice is to accept His guidance and mercy while u still have time my friend

I can't accept an imaginary being as "my lord".  And no deities exist.  So no.  Keep playing with your imaginary friend, but don't you dare assume that my belief or lack thereof is any of your business.

Ur absolutely right my friend. It is none of my business. I am only to warn what will happen. But as Allah tells us in the Qur'an no soul shall bear the burden of another. So what u do or don't do only u will be held responsible for. Just as what I do or don't do I will be held responsible for. So my friend to u be ur way of belief and to me be mine

What will happen, Sheed.  Tell us, what will happen if we fail to recognize your king?

@Mr

Quote:There was also a time in the Muslim empire when Caliph Omar famously said "spread wheat on top of the mountain, so it would not be said birds went hungry in the lands of Muslims" What the hell happened since then?

Ignoring that this is probably more than a little bit of embellishment on the part of chroniclers, I've wondered the same thing for a long time...and so have many muslims.  WTF happened?  Of late, it's been vogue to blame the great satan of the west for all the ills of the muslim world...but it had been in decline for longer than the great satan has even existed. I'll say this, people who look outside of themselves for a savior, from themselves and from their own situations...often fail to look within themselves when considering the cause of their plight.

(January 11, 2016 at 5:44 pm)drfuzzy Wrote:

(January 11, 2016 at 3:38 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: Life is an examination in Islam, don't you know. We're here because of what Satan (along with Adam & Eve) did in the garden. Each of us is experiencing the garden; one needs to figure out God by themselves, if God showed himself then what's the goal of this life.

The real question is : what would you do if God didn't show himself up, and you were alone in the garden ?
Some people kill, some others rape, others rob & steal, many others remain silent despite the crimes they see.

Science will never answer how the big bang came to be. The unsolvable base case.

The exam works. Realizing that it's a recursive function is step 1.

Science has already proven that there was no progenitor human couple - - no "Adam and Eve".  There was a mitochondrial "Eve" identified, but that does not mean that her mate, or mates, = "Adam".  No God, no Satan, no Garden of Eden, no heaven or hell.  Just a bunch of old fairy tales.

Mmmm, it's a question of "locating" their remains; which is a needle in a pile of grass.
But it's not an evidence or whatsoever against their existence.
Not finding the remains of somebody, doesn't mean they don't exist.

(January 12, 2016 at 5:12 am)AtlasS33 Wrote:

(January 11, 2016 at 5:44 pm)drfuzzy Wrote: Science has already proven that there was no progenitor human couple - - no "Adam and Eve".  There was a mitochondrial "Eve" identified, but that does not mean that her mate, or mates, = "Adam".  No God, no Satan, no Garden of Eden, no heaven or hell.  Just a bunch of old fairy tales.

Mmmm, it's a question of "locating" their remains; which is a needle in a pile of grass.
But it's not an evidence or whatsoever against their existence.
Not finding the remains of somebody, doesn't mean they don't exist.

They definitely didn't though.

(January 12, 2016 at 5:12 am)AtlasS33 Wrote:

(January 11, 2016 at 5:44 pm)drfuzzy Wrote: Science has already proven that there was no progenitor human couple - - no "Adam and Eve".  There was a mitochondrial "Eve" identified, but that does not mean that her mate, or mates, = "Adam".  No God, no Satan, no Garden of Eden, no heaven or hell.  Just a bunch of old fairy tales.

Mmmm, it's a question of "locating" their remains; which is a needle in a pile of grass.

No, it isn't.  There was no Adam and Eve.

Quote:But it's not an evidence or whatsoever against their existence.

The evidence is -conclusive-, there was no Adam...no Eve.

Quote:Not finding the remains of somebody, doesn't mean they don't exist.

It's not an issue of finding their remains. Genetics.

(January 12, 2016 at 5:18 am)SofaKingHigh Wrote:

(January 12, 2016 at 5:12 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: Mmmm, it's a question of "locating" their remains; which is a needle in a pile of grass.
But it's not an evidence or whatsoever against their existence.
Not finding the remains of somebody, doesn't mean they don't exist.

They definitely didn't though.

I see that it makes a lot of sense to assume, that in the long tree of human origin, God chose one creature and taught him how to use their brain. Science never said that they don't exist, and God never said how they looked like or what were they.

I don't see why they can't exist.

Stop, there was no Adam and Eve, this isn't an assumption. It's an inescapable conclusion of our genetic makeup. Similarly, there is no "magic moment" in which the heavens flew down and taught us how to think with our brains. We've been able to use them for as long as we've had them..and we've had them for longer than we've been human.

So, lets take any random thing.

Demon teapots. They exist, it's just a matter of finding them. They must exist because I just wrote it down.

No. It's sensible to assume they don't exist, until you find them, or any evidence that they are likely to exist or to have existed in the past. Anything else is the argument from ignorance, as usual. Science doesn't deal in absolute certainty, it's a useless concept. Questioning absolutely everything to try and then achieve one specific unsupported goal is dishonest nonsense.

"Just because you haven't found them, that doesn't mean they don't exist."

True but irrelevant.

"Therefor, it's reasonable to believe that they do exist."

Not true. The hidden implication in any argument from ignorance.

Or the other formulation:

"Do you have the answer to this question?"

No I don't.

"Therefor, my answer is valid."

No. It's up to you to demonstrate your answer is valid. Whether or not I have the answer is irrelevant. "You don't know I'm wrong" does not equal "I'm right". You may indeed be right, but you've made no argument to convince anyone that you actually are.

(January 12, 2016 at 5:52 am)Rhythm Wrote: Stop, there was no Adam and Eve, this isn't an assumption. It's an inescapable conclusion of our genetic makeup.  Similarly, there is no "magic moment" in which the heavens flew down and taught us how to think with our brains.  We've been able to use them for as long as we've had them..and we've had them for longer than we've been human.

I'll put many lines under "inescapable"; as in : "according to whom ?"

robvalue

If you say so, and if I happened to be a very very close friend (who actually trusts you 100% as a truthful & honest fella), I might believe you, as long as nothing contradicts the existence of demonic teapots.

Scientifically, nobody knows how & when humans started to read and worship deities, but also there is no ancient film showing how humans were not taught by a God.

Sometimes, proving something ,is all about disproving another thing. No disprove ? no proof.