(January 28, 2016 at 3:14 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 1:17 pm)Brian37 Wrote: No, Allah is the only deity you believe in. He is not the only deity claimed by humans. You are in the same boat as Christians and Hindus and Sikhs ect ect ect ect. Get in like take a number.

That's what faith is all about my friend. We gotta have faith in the right One, and do good deeds throughout our temporary lives on this Earth from which we were created in order to be successful in the Hereafter. Allah as The Most Merciful gives us chance after chance to obtain His forgiveness and guidance. We should all be grateful and seek it b4 it's too late. When we feel that soul being taken out of our bodies, just like Allah says in the Qur'an, all the way to the exit at the clavicle (collarbone). Will it come out smoothly, like water coming out of a waterskin or will it come out violently like a branch of thorns being pulled through wet wool? When it's our time it is definitely going to happen. Which one do u want?

Yep, faith does not require you to consider you got it wrong. Simply swallow without question. Yep, other people have faith in Yahweh, other people have faith in Vishnu, other people have faith in Buddha. Get in line, take a number.

(January 28, 2016 at 3:14 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 1:17 pm)Brian37 Wrote: No, Allah is the only deity you believe in. He is not the only deity claimed by humans. You are in the same boat as Christians and Hindus and Sikhs ect ect ect ect. Get in like take a number.

That's what faith is all about my friend. We gotta have faith in the right One, and do good deeds throughout our temporary lives on this Earth from which we were created in order to be successful in the Hereafter.

And how do you know that you have faith in the right one? Sounds like a sucker bet to me.

How about instead of faith you have reason and evidence? What is your reason and evidence for following Allah?

(January 28, 2016 at 4:24 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 3:14 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote: That's what faith is all about my friend. We gotta have faith in the right One, and do good deeds throughout our temporary lives on this Earth from which we were created in order to be successful in the Hereafter.

And how do you know that you have faith in the right one?  Sounds like a sucker bet to me.

How about instead of faith you have reason and evidence?   What is your reason and evidence for following Allah?

Well first of all it's guidance from God. I know that's where our different opinions come in but... Secondly the different scientific, mathematical, linguistic and astronomical miracles in the Qur'an, a book revealed in the 7th century, when science and technology didn't yet exist, but with what we have today verifies that the author of the Qur'an, knew EXACTLY what they were talking about, when microscopes and X-ray machines, and telescopes and satellites hadn't been thought about let alone invented. So with all of these examples of miracles of the Qur'an that even show future events, could be nothing but the absolute truth, and this being who says He is the Creator of the universe has given me enough proof in this Qur'an the He is absolutely the Lord of the worlds.

Polly want a cracker?

And others get their "guidance" from other gods. Well no, they, like you simply think they are getting that from a super natural being. What you are doing and all believers of all labels do, is needlessly self inflict yourself with the idea that life would suck or has to always such if there was no god.

God is in your head, but only because you like the idea. There is no super magical man with a magic wand pulling your strings or fighting with a super villain battling over the neurons in your brain.

Sure, if you want Allah to be real, he is real to you, but that does not constitute reality, it merely means you like the idea of having a super hero. Don't feel bad, believers of all labels fall for the same appeal to emotion you use to convince yourself your god claim is true.

(January 28, 2016 at 3:57 pm)Brian37 Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 3:14 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote: That's what faith is all about my friend. We gotta have faith in the right One, and do good deeds throughout our temporary lives on this Earth from which we were created in order to be successful in the Hereafter. Allah as The Most Merciful gives us chance after chance to obtain His forgiveness and guidance. We should all be grateful and seek it b4 it's too late. When we feel that soul being taken out of our bodies, just like Allah says in the Qur'an, all the way to the exit at the clavicle (collarbone). Will it come out smoothly, like water coming out of a waterskin or will it come out violently like a branch of thorns being pulled through wet wool? When it's our time it is definitely going to happen. Which one do u want?

Yep, faith does not require you to consider you got it wrong. Simply swallow without question. Yep, other people have faith in Yahweh, other people have faith in Vishnu, other people have faith in Buddha. Get in line, take a number.

Well after we die and leave this world we will all know the truth. Someone's gotta be right and someones gotta be wrong right? So again I say To you be your way if belief and to me be mine

(January 28, 2016 at 5:20 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 3:57 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Yep, faith does not require you to consider you got it wrong. Simply swallow without question. Yep, other people have faith in Yahweh, other people have faith in Vishnu, other people have faith in Buddha. Get in line, take a number.

Well after we die and leave this world we will all know the truth. Someone's gotta be right and someones gotta be wrong right? So again I say To you be your way if belief and to me be mine

Nope, when we die, thats it. It will feel exactly like it did before you were born, nothing, nadda, you simply don't exist anymore.

I am not that self centered to think I am that important to a 14 billion year old universe with 100s of billions of galaxies in it.  I value the one life I have now while I am alive. But the only thing that scares me about death is prolonged pain and my loved ones missing me after I die. 10 billion years from now our species will be long extinct, and even after that our sun will die and turn this planet into a piece of coal, and non of our human invented fantasies humans call gods will be remembered. God claims will die with our species when it goes extinct.

Now that does not make me fatalistic. I just means I don't gap fill with fictional utopias that don't exist. The ride ends for all life and the ride will end for our planet too. I simply value life as it is without superstition or sky heros.

(January 28, 2016 at 5:13 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 4:24 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: And how do you know that you have faith in the right one?  Sounds like a sucker bet to me.

How about instead of faith you have reason and evidence?   What is your reason and evidence for following Allah?

Well first of all it's guidance from God. I know that's where our different opinions come in but... Secondly the different scientific, mathematical, linguistic and astronomical miracles in the Qur'an, a book revealed in the 7th century, when science and technology didn't yet exist, but with what we have today verifies that the author of the Qur'an, knew EXACTLY what they were talking about, when microscopes and X-ray machines, and telescopes and satellites hadn't been thought about let alone invented. So with all of these examples of miracles of the Qur'an that even show future events, could be nothing but the absolute truth, and this being who says He is the Creator of the universe has given me enough proof in this Qur'an the He is absolutely the Lord of the worlds.

Did you know about these miracles when you first began to believe in Allah or did knowledge of the miracles come later?

(January 28, 2016 at 5:27 pm)Brian37 Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 5:20 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote: Well after we die and leave this world we will all know the truth. Someone's gotta be right and someones gotta be wrong right? So again I say To you be your way if belief and to me be mine

Nope, when we die, thats it. It will feel exactly like it did before you were born, nothing, nadda, you simply don't exist anymore.

I am not that self centered to think I am that important to a 14 billion year old universe with 100s of billions of galaxies in it.  I value the one life I have now while I am alive. But the only thing that scares me about death is prolonged pain and my loved ones missing me after I die. 10 billion years from now our species will be long extinct, and even after that our sun will die and turn this planet into a piece of coal, and non of our human invented fantasies humans call gods will be remembered. God claims will die with our species when it goes extinct.

Now that does not make me fatalistic. I just means I don't gap fill with fictional utopias that don't exist. The ride ends for all life and the ride will end for our planet too. I simply value life as it is without superstition or sky heros.

There are some verses of the Qur'an I'd like to share with u. CH.56 verses 47-56... 47)For they used to say "What! When we die and become dust and bones shall we be raised up?"(48)We and our fathers of old?(49)Say" Indeed" People of times of old and people of later times.(50)All shall certainly be gathered together for the meeting appointed for a day well known.(51)Then indeed you who go astray(52)Surely you shall taste of the tree of Zaqqum.(53)Then you shall fill your insides therewith.(54)On top of that you shall drink scalding water.(55)Indeed you will drink like diseased camels raging with thirst.(56)Such will be their entertainment on the day of judgment.

---

(January 28, 2016 at 5:41 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 5:13 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote: Well first of all it's guidance from God. I know that's where our different opinions come in but... Secondly the different scientific, mathematical, linguistic and astronomical miracles in the Qur'an, a book revealed in the 7th century, when science and technology didn't yet exist, but with what we have today verifies that the author of the Qur'an, knew EXACTLY what they were talking about, when microscopes and X-ray machines, and telescopes and satellites hadn't been thought about let alone invented. So with all of these examples of miracles of the Qur'an that even show future events, could be nothing but the absolute truth, and this being who says He is the Creator of the universe has given me enough proof in this Qur'an the He is absolutely the Lord of the worlds.

Did you know about these miracles when you first began to believe in Allah or did knowledge of the miracles come later?

After I believed in Him. I studied and am studying more and more. And He gives in the Qur'an examples to increase the faith of believers, to give certainty to the people of the Book (Jews and Christians of old), and those who have diseases in their hearts will just shun it. If u like, my friend I'd be more than happy to share some of the miracles with u to get ur view on where they fall.

(January 28, 2016 at 5:58 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 5:41 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: Did you know about these miracles when you first began to believe in Allah or did knowledge of the miracles come later?

After I believed in Him. I studied and am studying more and more. And He gives in the Qur'an examples to increase the faith of believers, to give certainty to the people of the Book (Jews and Christians of old), and those who have diseases in their hearts will just shun it. If u like, my friend I'd be more than happy to share some of the miracles with u to get ur view on where they fall.

I'm sure they are as convincing to you as they are unconvincing to me. The bulk fall under the headings of numerology and retconning, the practice of putting new interpretations on old passages as if the interpretation was there all along. I don't think we need a rehash.

(January 28, 2016 at 6:11 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote:

(January 28, 2016 at 5:58 pm)Sheed1980 Wrote: After I believed in Him. I studied and am studying more and more. And He gives in the Qur'an examples to increase the faith of believers, to give certainty to the people of the Book (Jews and Christians of old), and those who have diseases in their hearts will just shun it. If u like, my friend I'd be more than happy to share some of the miracles with u to get ur view on where they fall.

I'm sure they are as convincing to you as they are unconvincing to me.  The bulk fall under the headings of numerology and retconning, the practice of putting new interpretations on old passages as if the interpretation was there all along.  I don't think we need a rehash.

Well I know how a lot of atheists believe in scientific and astronomical reasoning and as I said there are plenty of examples of the Qur'an that are supported by these schools of thought. For example there are 114 chapters in the Qur'an. Ch.57 is Al-Hadyd or The Iron. Arabic letters have numerical value like Roman numerals in a sense. So with the word for iron Hadyd...(Ha)H=8 (Dal)D=4 (Ya)Y=10 and (Dal)=4. Add these values together u get 26. Look on any periodic table on Fe the symbol for iron u see the atomic number is 26. Now furthermore the Arabic article Al which means the (Alif)A=1 and(Lam)L=30. Add this 31 to the value of 26 Making it 57 and Al-Hadyd "The iron" which is the chapter name and number. To take it 1 step further 57 is exactly halfway through the Qur'an..scientists have discovered that if u cut the Earth in half, exactly to its inner core, it consists of molten iron.