(February 2, 2016 at 3:09 pm)mediocrates Wrote:

(February 2, 2016 at 1:51 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote: If nature has shown us anything its that if something is not really required nature will jettison it.

too bad nature didn't jettison my appendix...

Give it time.

(February 2, 2016 at 2:45 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: Then we Christians will still remain grateful for whatever amount of Grace our Creator has extended to us. He owes us nothing. We owe Him everything.

So you ARE a Christian! That's what I've been wanting to know since the first time we ever exchanged posts on this forum. [emoji39]

(February 2, 2016 at 2:45 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: Then we Christians will still remain grateful for whatever amount of Grace our Creator has extended to us. He owes us nothing. We owe Him everything.

How would it be possible for you to be greatful when you have no awareness? This is the premise, that your awareness dies with your physical brain, which turns out to be the only source which is capable of sustaining that.

I did promise not to challenge the validity of theological ideas on this thread, but bear in mind that what the above premise may imply is that the god which you believe in doesn't really exist.

(February 2, 2016 at 2:54 pm)GodCherry Wrote:

(February 2, 2016 at 2:45 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: Then we Christians will still remain grateful for whatever amount of Grace our Creator has extended to us. He owes us nothing. We owe Him everything.

I actually have no idea what this is supposed to mean.

One of the things I truly dislike about some of the christians I encounter is their inability to know the difference between having an intelligent conversation and repeating some inane mantra that they learned at church.

Mantras are like armor against logical thought, enlightenment and reason.  When you know everything...you're capable of learning nothing.

And there's always something to learn.  Rational humans should always be skeptical of any person or organization that claims to know the answer to everything.

“The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.”

Terry Pratchett

(February 2, 2016 at 2:51 pm)Whateverist the White Wrote: Of course our 'creation' may mean no more to Him than my taking a dump does to me.  If the microbes inhabiting my stool feel grateful, would I know?  Does our gratitude mean any more to God?

Why would God want our gratitude or worship?  This is something I've never understood. What does he get out of it?  Is the almighty creator of the universe so insecure that he needs to worship and adulation of beings lesser than him? 

I took part in creating my kids.  I don't want their worship.  I appreciate their love and gratitude, but do not feel that it is something that is owed to me.

(February 2, 2016 at 8:20 pm)Cecelia Wrote:

(February 2, 2016 at 2:51 pm)Whateverist the White Wrote: Of course our 'creation' may mean no more to Him than my taking a dump does to me.  If the microbes inhabiting my stool feel grateful, would I know?  Does our gratitude mean any more to God?

Why would God want our gratitude or worship?  This is something I've never understood. What does he get out of it?  Is the almighty creator of the universe so insecure that he needs to worship and adulation of beings lesser than him? 

I took part in creating my kids.  I don't want their worship.  I appreciate their love and gratitude, but do not feel that it is something that is owed to me.

The christian god is kind of like Donald Trump.  He just wants you to slowly drink the kool-aid.

(February 2, 2016 at 8:24 pm)GodCherry Wrote: The christian god is kind of like Donald Trump.  He just wants you to slowly drink the kool-aid.

"You're all a bunch of losers.  Now Lucifer, that was a real winner.  Make Heaven Great Again!    Those people down there are acting up?  I'm going to send a flood and make them pay for it.  We've gotta keep all the non-hebrews out of Israel.  Pharaoh is a loser.  They're not sending their virgins.  They're sending their whores, their prostitutes, and some, I assume, are good people.  Just kill them all, okay?  And take the virgins for yourselves.  I have a plan.  I'm not going to tell you what that plan is.  I work in mysterious ways, okay?" 

Seems legit.

(February 2, 2016 at 4:33 pm)God of Mr. Hanky Wrote: How would it be possible for you to be greatful when you have no awareness?

Nothing prevents me from being grateful right here and right now.

(February 2, 2016 at 2:55 pm)The Valkyrie Wrote: Hypothetical questions:  If humans create an intelligent species, should we expect them to worship us.  Do we have the right of life and death over them? How long do they have to worship us/praise us/be thankful to us, before they can live their own lives?

That's the catch, isn't it.

We won't demand anything from them. But what's to stop them from creating a religion with us as their Godly creators?
They may also use this as a tool for control. Who are we to intervene.

Even if we did have a creator (extremely unlikely), why would "it" want to intervene?
Unless "it" created us for the sole purpose of having an army of worshipping slaves.

So either way, God=bad news.

Let me guess: then they'll never know.