Well, the deal with Iran seems to do it's job. After Iran's move to encourage tourism and to invite western investors, Rouhani now calls for women's rights.

Quote:In a speech marking Women's Day, Mr Rouhani criticised "those who consider women's presence society as a threat" and said Iran still had "a long way to go" to ensure gender equality.

Quote:"According to the Islamic rules, man is not the stronger sex and woman is not the weaker one," he said.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-27099151

Well, according to the Quran women are lesser. Maybe stop basing society on a stupid old book.

But hey, this sounds like good news!

Money and the infusion of western culture is bound to produce more moderates. I've been saying it for years.

We fear the sultan less when we empower the people.

I think he is wrong about what the Islamic rules say, but if your going to delude yourself it might as well be for the better.

(February 7, 2016 at 10:03 am)robvalue Wrote: Well, according to the Quran women are lesser. Maybe stop basing society on a stupid old book.

But hey, this sounds like good news!

Well I just said on twitter related to this, it does not help that our right wing shits it's pants over others existing. 

It is a myth that there are no progressives in the Islamic world. It is simply the powers in control that make it virtually impossible for change to happen. And you compound that with our right wing Christian dominion bullshit, of course that freaks them out. 

No, that doesn't justify Islam being stuck in it's own dark ages. But it doesn't give confidence to those stuck under those theocracies, who want to get with the modern world. 

Any Muslim who may read this has to know that there are plenty in the west who are not warmongers whom simply understand that a global war will hurt all 7 billion of us. We'd simply like it if you stop threatening the west with your god. TRUST US, we also don't like our right wing Christians threatening us with their God.

I am under no illusions that either Islam or Christianity, or even Jewish religions will be forced out of existence. But it sure would be nice if all of you would stop using our entire planet as your pissing contest.

My wife thinks the "it's not unislamic" part is a pragmatic attempt to slowly roll things forward while not causing riots.

Well, I really hope this works. Surely they can see that the west manages to live in equality and Allah hasn't come and destroyed the whole place.

(February 7, 2016 at 10:35 am)robvalue Wrote: My wife thinks the "it's not unislamic" part is a pragmatic attempt to slowly roll things forward while not causing riots.

Well, I really hope this works. Surely they can see that the west manages to live in equality and Allah hasn't come and destroyed the whole place.

Well I have three particular atheists on another website whom because I agree with Hitchens on calling religion poison, somehow because I agree with that assessment, I am automatically a warmongering bigot myself on par with right wing Christians and right wing Muslims.

The planet cannot afford a global war, not with the nukes involved. It would not be a win for any label. Someone might come out on top if we don't go extinct from one. But the world would not be the same, our species would be literally knocked back to the stone age.

There is no such thing as a utopia, not even for atheists. So yea, if we can simply get the east to catch up with western pluralism, that leash on theocracy there will make the world more stable. 

I'd still tell someone like Malala her god does not exist, and even say "bullshit Malala", but my empathy for her and her value for women's rights and valuing peace over war is what we have in common.

Ah yeah... I was trying to read her book. I admire her greatly, but her steadfast clinging to her religion makes me angry. Stupid, I know, but it's made it hard to keep reading the book. I "know too much". Of course, she has been indoctrinated. She's mentally trapped, and defending a horrid text.

With regards to Iran, I don't really care how they justify it to themselves, as long as they make progress. If new children are taught women are equal, that's what they'll believe, on the whole.

(February 7, 2016 at 10:53 am)robvalue Wrote: Ah yeah... I was trying to read her book. I admire her greatly, but her steadfast clinging to her religion makes me angry. Stupid, I know, but it's made it hard to keep reading the book. I "know too much". Of course, she has been indoctrinated. She's mentally trapped, and defending a horrid text.

With regards to Iran, I don't really care how they justify it to themselves, as long as they make progress. If new children are taught women are equal, that's what they'll believe, on the whole.

I agree she is awesome valuing education and non violence, but so would Ann Frank and Martin Luther King Jr. But valuing the empathy in my fellow humans, still would not, and does not, make the Christian or Muslim or Jewish god claims real. 

If you cant force delusions out of existence, which we cant, we still should have the right to blaspheme and ridicule those claims, and agree to common law and non violence as well. It will act as a civil leash for all parties involved.

Yup, I'll call her an awesome person, and I'll call her faith utterly stupid.