(February 13, 2016 at 3:35 pm)Napoléon Wrote:

(February 13, 2016 at 3:25 pm)Evie Wrote: Worse? WTF.

If not worse.

Not worse.

I dislike the fat acceptance movement mostly because it seems to encourage extreme obesity.
The girl in that pic is not at a terribly unhealthy weight, though. Not fat.

And yes, people can be concerened about strangers health without being all judgmental at the same time. In the US at least, everyone knows someone or is related to someone who is full on obese, and probably a fair few who are not obese but still very overweight. It is called empathy, and every time I see a kid who weighs more than I do, I feel like crying because I know that kid is going to have a life full of problems and it actually makes me very sad. An adult person who is so obese they cannot walk properly is just as like to bring tears to my eyes, because it reminds me of my brother, who I fear for greatly because he is so obese. His knees are both shot, and he is pre-diabetic already. My hubby has put a LOT on around the middle since I married him. I still love him just the same, but now I worry about his health more, because he sneaks candy and ice cream all the time, and he can't seem to stop. I don't want to lose him!

And I know that obese stranger I see has loved ones who feel the same way I do about my brother and my husband. If you don't think other humans have empathy for you, and just want to bully you or hate you, perhaps you are projecting.

It is an extremely complicated issue. Being underweight is no good for your health, but anorexia is rare compared to obesity, which is also terrible for your health. So why do we call one an eating disorder and feel free to encourage them to get professional help, while we are some kind of bully monsters if we do the exact same thing for the other?

If you are fat, I'll still love you for the person you are. But I will also encourage you to chose a healthier life style so I can keep loving you longer. I myself struggle constantly with being underweight, and I am not offended when my husband encourages me to finish my meal and stop picking at it, or brings me a pack of protein shakes as part of a valentines day gift *that actually happened). Even if it IS caused by a psychological disorder, then go get help for the underlying cause. Don't let society tell you it is ok to eat yourself to death any more than it is ok to starve yourself to death. Neither is ok.

Beautiful post Aroura.

I agree wholeheartedly, and I also commend you for going to the trouble to express yourself so thoroughly. Respect.

You're a lovely person and you're very kind, caring and compassionate.

I dunno. I don't think anyone has license to judge another person's relative health based on their BMI if you are not their doctor.

Concern for health just does not hold water. What of the thin person who eats fast food as a habit? Or an otherwise shitty diet?

I also disagree that "fat acceptance" encourages anyone to be fat. People are what they are. Judging them for being overweight doesn't make them not overweight. It only fuels the weight loss industry.

Teaching kids proper eating habits is a different topic.

I would never judge someone for having an above average BMI unless I was actually their doctor and qualified to judge.

And I still wouldn't judge the person in any judgemental sort of way if they were patently severely overweight... but when someone is severely morbidly obese to the point where it has an obvious negative impact on their health, I'd be dishonest if I didn't say I'd think that I don't have to be a doctor to tell that that is harming their health. But that doesn't mean I'm going to try and encourage them to lose their weight. It's none of my business and not effective to tell them "lose some weight", or "eat more healthily and exercise more".

I do think concern for health in those cases at least does hold water though. I do have compassion for the health of even strangers, and there is a degree of overweightness that becomes so severe that it is patently damaging to their health. But as I said, I certainly wouldn't consider an above average BMI in and of itself to be harmful to health. It would have to be severe enough to be undeniably obvious. And it's very true that a thin person who eats fast food as a habit or has a shitty diet may have as bad health even as someone who is very clearly obese to an unhealthy degree if they eat enough shit... it's merely that a severely obese person is more noticeably unhealthy than a thin person who eats shitty fast food all the time.

(February 13, 2016 at 3:57 pm)Mermaid Wrote: I dunno. I don't think anyone has license to judge another person's relative health based on their BMI if you are not their doctor.

Concern for health just does not hold water. What of the thin person who eats fast food as a habit? Or an otherwise shitty diet?

I also disagree that "fat acceptance" encourages anyone to be fat. People are what they are. Judging them for being overweight doesn't make them not overweight. It only fuels the weight loss industry.

Teaching kids proper eating habits is a different topic.

Yes, skinny fat is a thing. There are tons of those people around too, and if I know a person who eats junk food constantly, I also have sympathy for them, because I know our society and constant advertisement encourage it, and also how hard it is to be a working person or parent and find time to cook healthy foods.

Sympathy =/= judgement.

Do you feel ok in judging an anorexic person as being unhealthy (this is not judging them as a full human being, you are just judging their health based on knowing they have anorexia), and think that it is ok to encourage that person to seek a doctors help in getting better?  What do you think "getting better" means in this instance? Does it mean accepting that she is anorexic and underweight?  I mean, people are what they are.  Right?

Yes, there needs to be waay more focus in our society on teaching healthy eating habits. But I think corporate America likes keeping us fat, skinny fat, and anorexic because, as you say, it feeds their money machines.  That does not mean you should just give up and accept being obese (or eating junk, or anorexia).

People can be somewhat overweight and healthy. The girl in the OP is a good example, her weight in the after pic could easily be a healthy weight. But you CANNOT be so large that you are unable to walk and be healthy.  To constantly set up one as the argument when we are clearly talking about the other is a strawman.  It is no different than saying the girl in the before pic was healthy just because she could do 90 minutes of cardio.

(February 13, 2016 at 3:56 pm)Evie Wrote: Beautiful post Aroura.

I agree wholeheartedly, and I also commend you for going to the trouble to express yourself so thoroughly. Respect.

You're a lovely person and you're very kind, caring and compassionate.

You always make me blush Evie, lol.  I am a flawed person who is quite often horrible, even if i don't mean to be!  You always make me feel better about myself, though. : Just having you on the forums cheers this whole place up.

(February 13, 2016 at 4:10 pm)Aroura Wrote:

(February 13, 2016 at 3:57 pm)Mermaid Wrote: I dunno. I don't think anyone has license to judge another person's relative health based on their BMI if you are not their doctor.

Concern for health just does not hold water. What of the thin person who eats fast food as a habit? Or an otherwise shitty diet?

I also disagree that "fat acceptance" encourages anyone to be fat. People are what they are. Judging them for being overweight doesn't make them not overweight. It only fuels the weight loss industry.

Teaching kids proper eating habits is a different topic.

Yes, skinny fat is a thing. There are tons of those people around too, and if I know a person who eats junk food constantly, I also have sympathy for them, because I know our society and constant advertisement encourage it, and also how hard it is to be a working person or parent and find time to cook healthy foods.

Sympathy =/= judgement.

Do you feel ok in judging an anorexic person as being unhealthy (this is not judging them as a full human being, you are just judging their health based on knowing they have anorexia), and think that it is ok to encourage that person to seek a doctors help in getting better?  What do you think "getting better" means in this instance? Does it mean accepting that she is anorexic and underweight?  I mean, people are what they are.  Right?

Yes, there needs to be waay more focus in our society on teaching healthy eating habits. But I think corporate America likes keeping us fat, skinny fat, and anorexic because, as you say, it feeds their money machines.  That does not mean you should just give up and accept being obese (or eating junk, or anorexia).

People can be somewhat overweight and healthy. The girl in the OP is a good example, her weight in the after pic could easily be a healthy weight. But you CANNOT be so large that you are unable to walk and be healthy.  To constantly set up one as the argument when we are clearly talking about the other is a strawman.  It is no different than saying the girl in the before pic was healthy just because she could do 90 minutes of cardio.

I think commenting or having an opinion about someone else's body condition is judging. Good, bad, whatever. She's healthy, she's unhealthy, she's a good weight, she's a bad weight.

My point is that people seem to think it's ok to talk about the bodies of other people, and I just don't think that's okay. At all. either way, good or bad.

and for what it's worth, Aurora, my comments about judgment are not directed toward you, I hear what you are saying and agree to a point. I guess I am talking about the tome of this whole thread.