I see polls that show the majority of Americans (or Merkins as one of my friends used to say) are Christian. After sixty years of field observations in 42 states I would disagree. What Merkins are really good at is checking the right boxes on polls.

The situation as I see it. Most people here confront the issue of religion like this:

"Are you a Christian?"

"Yes."

"Okay, so am I."

Note that there is no proof needed, the claim is all that is required. Once the person has said the right thing the matter is dropped. They don't have to tend to the sick or feed the poor or even observe the Sabbath, they just have to say the right thing. And they say it defensively to avoid having to deal with the issue.

Church attendance is down. People give more money to Steve Jobs than they do to their churches. They certainly don't act like Christians (unless Jesus said it's okay to nearly kill someone to get one car-length ahead on the morning commute.)

So, if you hear "Americans mostly Christian", you can be safe in thinking, "or so they claim."

The issue is how to get them to be honest about their actual lack of religion.

You seem to assume that being a christian involves being nice and treating other people well.
This is not what history tells us.
Being an ignorant arsehole is consistant with the how christianity has developed, at least in the west.

(April 23, 2011 at 7:04 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: You seem to assume that being a christian involves being nice and treating other people well.
This is not what history tells us.
Being an ignorant arsehole is consistant with the how christianity has developed, at least in the west.

Ah, but you're citing "actual Christian" while I was saying "book Christian". "Actual Christian" is, indeed, just another people. (I tend to separate people and humans, despite there being a small overlap between the two.)

"Actual Christians" (henceforth A/C's) are simply those people that say "I'm a Christian". The B/C's, if they exist at all, are damn hard to find.

I understand that there HAS been a research poll (should be on this forum somewhere...???) where the question was asked...."write down your activities from midnight on Saturday to Midnight on Sunday." it showed that "the majority" dwindled to around a third???

don't quote me on the figures

I'm sure a survey like the one tearfund do would reach similar conclusions in the US... ie substantially different to the commonly held perception.

UK people consider themselves Christians from a Christian nation without ever having visited a church in most instances, let alone actually having a belief which would reflect the slightest understanding of their claim.

(April 23, 2011 at 7:11 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: I understand that there HAS been a research poll (should be on this forum somewhere...???) where the question was asked...."write down your activities from midnight on Saturday to Midnight on Sunday." it showed that "the majority" dwindled to around a third???

don't quote me on the figures

The Teabaggies were surveyed on this and other things. The figures given for this group that supposedly espouses strong Christian values as part of its program showed that only about 20% of them had been to church in the last week.

It's been the long-held opinion of mine (for my age group) and one of my best friends (who's 15 years older, for his) that while a little more of my age are more open about the idea, plenty in both are just afraid to admit their disbelief on account of being called "baby eaters". Also I don't think a lot of them realize what being an atheist actually means.

(April 23, 2011 at 7:17 am)fr0d0 Wrote: I'm sure a survey like the one tearfund do would reach similar conclusions in the US... ie substantially different to the commonly held perception.

UK people consider themselves Christians from a Christian nation without ever having visited a church in most instances, let alone actually having a belief which would reflect the slightest understanding of their claim.

And they want to remain ignorant of the requirements for a "real Christian life", because it would expose their hypocrisy.

I'm reminded of the number of "christians" who have tried to defend the bible on this forum, but when you actually press them on the matter it turns out they haven't even read it.

(April 23, 2011 at 7:55 am)Zen Badger Wrote: I'm reminded of the number of "christians" who have tried to defend the bible on this forum, but when you actually press them on the matter it turns out they haven't even read it.

A few months back I saw a survey that indicated atheists are much more knowledgeable on religious matters than those who claim to be religious. I mentioned this to one of my cousins and she said, "I sleep with my bible under my pillow, so the word of God can come directly to me." I replied, "So what do you think of Ezekiel 13?" She asked me if that was in the OT or the NT.