Agnostic = "I don't know"

Ignostic = "I don't know what you're talking about"

(July 29, 2016 at 10:42 am)Alasdair Ham Wrote: "God is love"

"God is nature"

"God is the universe"

"God is a concept"

Hardly makes you a theist

How about "God is whatever philosophical principle or creative property that allows the Universe to exist?"  That I believe in necessarily. I also think panpsychism is a possibility, and in that case I'd think of the Universe as God, but literally have no way to confirm it.

Sometimes, you're agnostic in a conditional sense: I believe IF idea X is true, then God is real. But you have no way to validate idea X. (for example, panpsychism). At any rate, being shouted at, "Are you dumb? Do you believe in a god, any god, yes or no?" is kind of insulting, and makes for pretty boring conversation.

(July 29, 2016 at 10:58 am)robvalue Wrote: Agnostic = "I don't know"

Ignostic = "I don't know what you're talking about"

There are a lot of reasons I don't know things-- definition of terms being only one of them.  Others include drug use and drops on head as baby.

(July 29, 2016 at 10:55 am)Alasdair Ham Wrote: EP has improved a lot though.

He seems to be working on it but I think I'll tune him out until the ambient annoyance in my forum experience comes down.

Sure, I guess you could say ignosticism is a specific form of agnosticism. But I think it's more informative, it lets the person know there's bigger problems at hand.

(July 29, 2016 at 11:00 am)bennyboy Wrote:

(July 29, 2016 at 10:42 am)Alasdair Ham Wrote: "God is love"

"God is nature"

"God is the universe"

"God is a concept"

Hardly makes you a theist

How about "God is whatever philosophical principle or creative property that allows the Universe to exist?"  That I believe in necessarily.

I believe existence itself is eternal because it makes no sense to say existence itself is ever nonexistent.

(July 29, 2016 at 11:00 am)bennyboy Wrote:

(July 29, 2016 at 10:42 am)Alasdair Ham Wrote: "God is love"

"God is nature"

"God is the universe"

"God is a concept"

Hardly makes you a theist

How about "God is whatever philosophical principle or creative property that allows the Universe to exist?"  That I believe in necessarily.

I can't envision how the human practices of philosophy or general creativity could have entered into the formation of the universe as we know it.  Facts about us can explain why we perceive it as we do, but not how it got to be the way it is.  Still I approve of these human practices.  I just don't like to mix them with cosmology.

(July 29, 2016 at 10:37 am)Alasdair Ham Wrote:

(July 29, 2016 at 10:35 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: Some people are non-believers regarding gods, but most are believers. There is no other state between belief and non-belief. You either believe or you don't. Do I have to explain what belief is to a whole forum of atheists? Seriously?

It's true you either believe or you don't. Who was disagreeing with that?

Benny, for one, and every single one of his defenders.

(July 29, 2016 at 10:42 am)bennyboy Wrote:

(July 29, 2016 at 10:21 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: Benny, I might have asked you this before, but since I read your last replies to me, do you believe in any Gods at all?

I believe in things I've heard others refer to as God. I'm still going to have to ask you what you mean, or I'm still going to have to answer that I don't know.  From my perspective, you are asking "Do you believe in x?"  I don't know, since I don't know what that term represents.

While there are things others call God religiously and we may believe in them, that doesn't mean we believe in Gods unless we specifically think of them as Gods as well. So, once again, benny, do you believe in any Gods or not?

(July 29, 2016 at 10:42 am)Alasdair Ham Wrote: "God is love"

"God is nature"

"God is the universe"

"God is a concept"

Hardly makes you a theist

Then it makes him an atheist. There is no third option here, I'm afraid.