(September 15, 2016 at 7:49 am)Excited Penguin Wrote:

(September 15, 2016 at 7:40 am)Alex K Wrote: At least it exists somewhere, as opposed to an Utopia, which, by its very name, doesn't

That's not true. A dystopia is just as imaginary as an utopia. Both serve the same purpose, namely that of guides to a better world.

I was for fun being a bit more literal with the names...

(September 15, 2016 at 7:50 am)Alex K Wrote:

(September 15, 2016 at 7:49 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: That's not true. A dystopia is just as imaginary as an utopia. Both serve the same purpose, namely that of guides to a better world.

I was for fun being a bit more literal with the names...

I'm sorry, that completely escaped me.

(September 15, 2016 at 7:49 am)Excited Penguin Wrote:

(September 15, 2016 at 7:40 am)Alex K Wrote: At least it exists somewhere, as opposed to an Utopia, which, by its very name, doesn't

That's not true. A dystopia is just as imaginary as an utopia. Both serve the same purpose, namely that of guides to a better world.

No a dystopia is what we all nearly have and what a great many people around the world already have.

Have some education:

dys·to·pi·a
disˈtōpēə/
noun
an imagined place or state in which everything is unpleasant or bad, typically a totalitarian or environmentally degraded one.

You want totalitarian control and surveillance, not an enlightened self responsible society. You're getting it

Did I mention we are in the midst of the 6th Great Extinction of all life on earth, caused by man? You're getting it.

(September 15, 2016 at 7:47 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: Do you just pretend to be stupid or... ?

You're trying to get on my creative side, aren't you?

(September 15, 2016 at 7:51 am)Excited Penguin Wrote:

(September 15, 2016 at 7:50 am)Alex K Wrote: I was for fun being a bit more literal with the names...

I'm sorry, that completely escaped me.

Utopia - Online Etymology Dictionary
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=utopia
Online Etymology Dictionary
Online Etymology Dictionary. 1551, from Modern Latin Utopia, literally "nowhere," coined by Thomas More (and used as title of his book, 1516, about an imaginary island enjoying the utmost perfection in legal, social, and political systems), from Greek ou "not" + topos "place" (see topos).

(September 15, 2016 at 7:50 am)Arkilogue Wrote:

(September 15, 2016 at 7:47 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: It's only a dystopia if you give up all of this for nothing. It's not if the reward more than makes up for it.

Do you just pretend to be stupid or... ?

The reward of the absolute end to your privacy of mind, privacy of life and drug induce behavior modification?

The propaganda is working very well...

Not of, but to.

Pay close attention to what I'm saying.

I would gladly give those things up for the best possible safety in a world where my lifespan would be either indefinite or significantly longer than the current average one.

Privacy is only there for protection to begin with. In a world where everyone is stripped of it there is no need for privacy anyway. In such a world your privacy would only be violated for the purpose of seeking out, monitoring and adjusting criminal thought and behaviour. That would be an worthy goal if it could be achieved as well as one would like. Technology might do wonders in that department.

Drugs would only affect those parts of your mental constitution that would be scientifically deemed as ill or dangerous to society. Such as the psychopath within.

We only feel like we need things like privacy because we're not perfect people. And we'd feel like giving up our personalities if we let an external agency fuck with our lives and our heads. But if we were to actually improve in the process, and go on to lead better and more significant lives as a result I wouldn't be able to see what the problem was, and nor would you, I think.

Now, for the purpose of demonstrating this, just imagine sharing a house with someone who you just know will never ever judge you, think a bad thought about you or report and/or gossip about you. Wouldn't you feel perfectly safe doing absolutely anything with them around?

How would you know they wouldn't do this, you might ask. Well, that's simple. They'd agree to give up their privacy as well, fully trusting you with it.

(September 15, 2016 at 7:54 am)Arkilogue Wrote:

(September 15, 2016 at 7:49 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: That's not true. A dystopia is just as imaginary as an utopia. Both serve the same purpose, namely that of guides to a better world.

No a dystopia is what we all nearly have and what a great many people around the world already have.

Have some education:

dys·to·pi·a
disˈtōpēə/
noun
an imagined place or state in which everything is unpleasant or bad, typically a totalitarian or environmentally degraded one.

You want totalitarian control and surveillance, not an enlightened self responsible society. You're getting it

Did I mention we are in the midst of the 6th Great Extinction of all life on earth, caused by man? You're getting it.

You can have both.

Everything is not unpleasant or bad. You can underline that part of the definition all you like, it still draws meaning from its first half. You're trying to modify the word's actual meaning in order for it to favor your forced interpretation of it.

We live as much in an utopia as we do in a dystopia. Both are imagined states.

(September 15, 2016 at 8:07 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: Now, for the purpose of demonstrating this, just imagine sharing a house with someone who you just know will never ever judge you, think a bad thought about you or report and/or gossip about you. Wouldn't you feel perfectly safe doing absolutely anything with them around?

How would you know they wouldn't do this, you might ask. Well, that's simple. They'd agree to give up their privacy as well, fully trusting you with it.

No, I wouldn't. I don't like an audience when I'm having sex with my wife.

No, it's because they've demonstrated reliably and consistency of word and action.


Tell me this, with all the thoughts that run in and out of your head, would you want someone monitoring all of them and making notes about what you should and shouldn't be thinking? I'm sure you have absolute control over your mind and there's nothing that you'd be embarrassed about being on display for everyone else to see...

Can you even imagine the absolutely horrifying chaos that would result if everyones immediate thoughts were on public display?

(September 15, 2016 at 8:16 am)Arkilogue Wrote:

(September 15, 2016 at 8:07 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: Now, for the purpose of demonstrating this, just imagine sharing a house with someone who you just know will never ever judge you, think a bad thought about you or report and/or gossip about you. Wouldn't you feel perfectly safe doing absolutely anything with them around?

How would you know they wouldn't do this, you might ask. Well, that's simple. They'd agree to give up their privacy as well, fully trusting you with it.

No, I wouldn't. I don't like an audience when I'm having sex with my wife.

No, it's because they've demonstrated reliably and consistency of word and action.


Tell me this, with all the thoughts that run in and out of your head, would you want someone monitoring all of them and making notes about what you should and shouldn't be thinking?  I'm sure you have absolute control over your mind and there's nothing that you'd be embarrassed about being on display for everyone else to see...

Can you even imagine the absolutely horrifying chaos that would result if everyones immediate thoughts were on public display?

I would be perfectly ok with it as long as I knew people would only act in either detaining me and "treating" me if I had criminal thoughts I actually intended to act on. Those same people would be monitored themselves.

I would prefer if an A.I. did this, but we're only talking hypothetically here anyway. So humans will have to do absent of anything better.

(September 15, 2016 at 8:13 am)Excited Penguin Wrote:

(September 15, 2016 at 7:54 am)Arkilogue Wrote: No a dystopia is what we all nearly have and what a great many people around the world already have.

Have some education:

dys·to·pi·a
disˈtōpēə/
noun
an imagined place or state in which everything is unpleasant or bad, typically a totalitarian or environmentally degraded one.

You want totalitarian control and surveillance, not an enlightened self responsible society. You're getting it

Did I mention we are in the midst of the 6th Great Extinction of all life on earth, caused by man? You're getting it.

You can have both.

Everything is not unpleasant or bad. You can underline that part of the definition all you like, it still draws meaning from its first half. You're trying to modify the word's actual meaning in order for it to favor your forced interpretation of it.

We live as much in an utopia as we do in a dystopia. Both are imagined states.

Sure you can have both. You have have a barrel full of rotting apples and one really nice one in the middle somewhere.

Take a good long look around you and realize, every single minuscule piece of civilization in the "real world" was once only an idea in someones imagination.

Things might bet rip roaring for you in your million dollar home...but the 6th Great Extinction is still well underway while 795 million people – or one in nine people in the world – do not have enough to eat.
98% of the world’s undernourished people live in developing countries.

While the US wastes 50% of all the food it produces and we have a career criminal and clown running for US president.

Oh yeah, the world is in debt 60 trillion dollar......probably owes Mars.

Also don't forget we live in the age of Terrorism now...don't forget....don't ever forget...it's unpatriotic.




Yeah things are looking real up for the humanity aren't they?