(November 11, 2016 at 12:50 pm)Rhythm Wrote: Gee, not gonna lock her up, not gonna build a wall...what's next?  We -won't- be getting concentration camps after all?

Shit.  Does he at least still plan to bomb terrorist's families and implement worse methods of torture than waterboarding?

(November 11, 2016 at 2:33 pm)abaris Wrote:

(November 11, 2016 at 2:30 pm)Rhythm Wrote: See, again...the wall had a hell of a psychological effect on you.

No, it acutally hadn't. I contemplated deleting the 40 years since that was longer than the actual Iron Curtain existed. 1958 was before and the Iron Curtain as well as the Berlin wall were a result of the massive migration that happened before.

So, I'm calling myself stupid now for not deleting the 40 and replace it with a 28, which would be the more appropriate number.

Would you like me to run the numbers on how many people escaped directly over the berlin wall in those 28 years, and then add to that the -much- larger number of people who just went -around- the walls where they existed? If that satisfies your metrics for a successful wall, a use of what would be billions and billions of dollars...then perhaps we just have different measures for success? It just doesn;t look like it worked to me, and that;s before we start to acknowledge that we're talking about an entirely different scenario...where people are trying to keep their own subjugated populace in..from territotry where they do have means of control and which is chock full of informants. The situation isn;t even equivalent. I doubt that mexico or mexicans would be any more willing than people on the other side of that wall were to help us enforce it. OFC, theres also the nagging detail of what -happened- to the group that built those walls. Did they thrive and prosper because of them..........did it make the soviets great again, lol?

Mind you, I'm not trying to force any of these positions on you, not saying that you think it did make them great again, for example..only trying to express why I cant see that wall as a success -on any level-....and we still haven't popped the cherry on the black market issue (one of the justifications offered for -our- wall).

(there's actually a chart in that link, directly beneath the bit I quoted)

as a semi sideline, and abaris I'd love to hear this if you have any recollection or are aware of it....but was there any propaganda from within the wall to the same effect as the propaganda leveraged in our election?  Where they going to curb the flow of people with the wall, was it going to make them stronger, was it gong to cut off the spigot of black market goods? Ws it an issue of sovereignty? I ask, because I think our resident republicans would blow a gasket if they found themselves aping soviet bullshit from the cold war. They;re perfectly fine with our cold war bullshit (or nazi shit, or kkk shit), mind you..but that would be too much for their geriatric hearts to bare..i think.....and hey, silver lining......they might not make it to the next election if they came to that depressing realization.

(November 11, 2016 at 3:20 pm)Rhythm Wrote: as a semi sideline, and abaris I'd love to hear this if you have any recollection or are aware of it....but was there any propaganda from within the wall to the same effect as the propaganda leveraged in our election?  Where they going to curb the flow of people with the wall, was it going to make them stronger, was it gong to cut off the spigot of black market goods?

I'm not entirely sure if I understand your question here, since these seem to be entirely different issues.

There was kind of a radio war going on. More of it coming from the west than the east. The west had the cooler music after all, but I'm pretty sure that's not what you're asking.

It wasn't like North Korea if it's that what you're aiming at. People behind the curtain were well aware of their shortcomings, given that airwaves didn't stop at borders and given that the tools to disturb those signals weren't up to todays standards in any case.

I assume that you guys could also get transmissions from the east side of the wall.  What were they saying? Specifically -about- the wall and their border policies?

(November 11, 2016 at 3:26 pm)Rhythm Wrote: I assume that you guys could also get transmissions from the east side of the wall.  What were they saying?

I didn't really follow them. I didn't have the least bit of interest. I only remember one instance when my father and I were sitting in our car, waiting for my mother and my father and I played around with the radio, seeing what stations we could catch. We stumbled over some station where a female voice said: Ici Tirana.

That was a station, broadcasting in French from the Albanian capital. We didn't follow what the broadcast was about, just had a good laugh over catching something like that.

Also, it still was the time of aerials, we could catch slovakian TV, then still part of Czechoslovakia. Not in good quality, since they used a different system, maybe even NTSC or SECAM, and the intent wasn't to broadcast for others but for their own population.

(November 11, 2016 at 1:07 pm)abaris Wrote: Oh, it's feasible. Ask the GDR of old. It only means that you have to have it to burn to make it near impenetrable. The GDR had over 2000 kilomters of highly secured borders with all the extras. Such as even shot systems. It's only that the Mexicans paying for it wasn't feasible. The outstretched middle finger got in the way.

Watch the video. Not only are there numerous obstacles to actually building the wall, Bush the dumber tried it back in 2006 and failed pretty badly.

(November 11, 2016 at 2:57 pm)Tonus Wrote:

(November 11, 2016 at 12:50 pm)Rhythm Wrote: Gee, not gonna lock her up, not gonna build a wall...what's next?  We -won't- be getting concentration camps after all?

Shit.  Does he at least still plan to bomb terrorist's families and implement worse methods of torture than waterboarding?

Magic 8-ball says "ask again later", as in...after trumps done snorting it.

Not surprised at all. The part that kills me is the idiots who actually thought a fucking wall would stop illegal immigration. If you believe a literal wall could stop illegal immigration, then I have a bridge to sell you. It was interesting to see people stick up for him and his wall idea even as the cost went from, "Very cheap, believe me" to 5 billion, to 10 billion, to 15 to 25...

And this sort of gets at what it is that really bothers me about the Trump supporters... This man actually has all of you fooled into thinking he's different from the other politicians. Hey. I'm not like these other guys. I know you. I know your struggle. I am your voice. Vote for me. Sound familiar? Every. Politician. Ever.

Pretty soon here we'll find out about all the promises he's going to break and keep. I guess time will tell.