(January 11, 2017 at 2:16 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(January 11, 2017 at 2:03 pm)Thena323 Wrote: Well, it's really not a selfless act, if the parents simply continue with the pregnancy out of a misguided notion that it keeps their asses from frying in Hell.

Rather than simply wanting to avoid heartache and pain, I would assume this hypothetical couple is just set on having "a good one". And perhaps have a religious objection to terminating a pregnancy that would result in what would clearly be an unwanted child (by the birth couple). 

It's silly to assume that someone who chooses to find adoptive parents for their unborn child is simply doing it because they want to avoid going to Hell by getting an abortion. 

Sure, it'd be silly to assume that about anyone.

I'm not to referring to just anyone, though. I'm referring to this particular hypothetical couple. The one who has the means to take care of a child, but has determined that a system of of "getting rid" of the undesirable ones via adoption, and keeping that "good ones" somehow puts them on moral high ground.

I don't think it does.

(January 11, 2017 at 1:47 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(January 10, 2017 at 7:52 pm)Nay_Sayer Wrote: I say dash the baby on some rocks, Get god that angel quicker

What the eff??

I know right? That's wasting a perfectly good Atheist's barbecue opportunity

(January 10, 2017 at 11:26 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: How do you guys feel about a couple who, upon learning their unborn baby had a mental impairment such as Down Syndrome (or other), decide to look for a good family to adopt their baby? Apparently there are people out there who feel a calling and have a passion for special needs children, and who specifically look for these types of babies to adopt. 

Let me also say that this pregnant couple has the financial means and plenty of support to take care of a mentally impaired child. But the reason they want to put their child up for adoption is because they feel like emotionally/mentally they just wouldn't be able to handle the grief and heartache that would come from seeing their child struggle through life.   

So, do you think it's wrong for the pregnant couple to choose to put their baby up for adoption in this case? Would you judge them? How do you feel about this type of decision?

(bolded to emphasize this would be about finding a loving adopted family prior to the birth, NOT leaving the child in an orphanage)

Here's the thing.. despite the popular narrative we are NOT all created equally. This means we are not all up to the responsibility of raising a Retarded (in the clinical sense/Yes it is still the proper term for at least another year) child.

But at the same time if a couple has been given this responsibility and they feel they can not handle it, they need to be asking why first, and not who can save me.

(January 10, 2017 at 11:26 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: How do you guys feel about a couple who, upon learning their unborn baby had a mental impairment such as Down Syndrome (or other), decide to look for a good family to adopt their baby? Apparently there are people out there who feel a calling and have a passion for special needs children, and who specifically look for these types of babies to adopt. 

Let me also say that this pregnant couple has the financial means and plenty of support to take care of a mentally impaired child. But the reason they want to put their child up for adoption is because they feel like emotionally/mentally they just wouldn't be able to handle the grief and heartache that would come from seeing their child struggle through life.   

So, do you think it's wrong for the pregnant couple to choose to put their baby up for adoption in this case? Would you judge them? How do you feel about this type of decision?

(bolded to emphasize this would be about finding a loving adopted family prior to the birth, NOT leaving the child in an orphanage)

I personally couldn't bear the thought of giving my child away, no matter what condition he/she was in at birth.  In fact, I find it even MORE gut-wrenching the thought of giving away a baby who has increased medical needs, and requires a higher level of care than even a healthy new born.  How could a mother abandon her helpless, struggling offspring like that?   I just don't get it.  Getting pregnant comes with many known risks (not that I have to tell you that, ofc).  Personally, I find it horrifying when people want to give away their babies because they're...not the kind of baby that they'd "hoped" for.  Bringing life into the world is the ultimate responsibility.  IMO, if you aren't prepared to assume all those known risks then you shouldn't be procreating, because you have very little control over what will happen.  This is only my personal, subjective, highly emotionally charged and biased opinion, btw.  ?

(January 11, 2017 at 10:20 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote:

(January 10, 2017 at 11:26 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: How do you guys feel about a couple who, upon learning their unborn baby had a mental impairment such as Down Syndrome (or other), decide to look for a good family to adopt their baby? Apparently there are people out there who feel a calling and have a passion for special needs children, and who specifically look for these types of babies to adopt. 

Let me also say that this pregnant couple has the financial means and plenty of support to take care of a mentally impaired child. But the reason they want to put their child up for adoption is because they feel like emotionally/mentally they just wouldn't be able to handle the grief and heartache that would come from seeing their child struggle through life.   

So, do you think it's wrong for the pregnant couple to choose to put their baby up for adoption in this case? Would you judge them? How do you feel about this type of decision?

(bolded to emphasize this would be about finding a loving adopted family prior to the birth, NOT leaving the child in an orphanage)

I personally couldn't bear the thought of giving my child away, no matter what condition he/she was in at birth.  In fact, I find it even MORE gut-wrenching the thought of giving away a baby who has increased medical needs, and requires a higher level of care than even a healthy new born.  How could a mother abandon her helpless, struggling offspring like that?   I just don't get it.  Getting pregnant comes with many known risks (not that I have to tell you that, ofc).  Personally, I find it horrifying when people want to give away their babies because they're...not the kind of baby that they'd "hoped" for.  Bringing life into the world is the ultimate responsibility.  IMO, if you aren't prepared to assume all those known risks then you shouldn't be procreating, because you have very little control over what will happen.  This is only my personal, subjective, highly emotionally charged and biased opinion, btw.  ?

I agree with you. After having it happen to me, I realize I personally could never have done it.

But I would have nothing but respect for those who choose to stay pregnant for the sake of giving their baby the best life possible with more capable parents.

(January 10, 2017 at 6:54 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Wow, that's a little harsh. As I said above, I would actually think it would be big of them to go through the sacrifice of pregnancy and childbirth (without a baby to look forward to) for the sake of giving their son/daughter the best life possible. 

To each their own though.

If you think pregnancy is a sacrifice, try the next eighteen years.

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(January 10, 2017 at 8:12 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I guess I don't see how it is selfish to go through a pregnancy (which is not easy) when you won't get anything out of it, so that you can give your mentally impaired child life and loving parents who are well equipped to take good care of him/her. I think having the child killed would be much more selfish.

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Anyway, I think I'm going to leave this thread. This was supposed to be about whether you think the scenario presented is or is not moral, and why. I wasn't really wanting to hear people say (or deliberately hint) that the handicapped baby should be aborted. Hits a bit too close to home, to be honest.

It's selfish in the sense that you're carrying the fetus (not child) to term, knowing fully well that that child will be doomed to a life of hardship, shopping the parenting out to someone else, because you have your morals which forbid you considering any other alternative.

(January 10, 2017 at 11:26 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: How do you guys feel about a couple who, upon learning their unborn baby had a mental impairment such as Down Syndrome (or other)

I think abortion in this case is the better choice than giving life to such a child which is nothing else but a mockery with its future life. What kind of a mother would give life to a child in the full consciousness that this child won't have a normal life? That this child will most probably be bullied and ridiculed by the other kids because it's different? I'm not mentally impaired and yet I know what it is to be different and to be constantly bullied for that at school. But there's one difference - I fought back. While that kid won't have the mental capacity to fight back thus it will be like green light for all bullies. Does that kid really deserve such a life only because the selfishness of the mother and the fear to lose her offspring? Because of her selfishness and fear of the loss, that kid will have to spend the rest of its life in being the regular subject of ridicules and a punch bag for bullies.
I don't know about you but if I were a mother, I wouldn't do that to my kid.

(January 12, 2017 at 1:44 am)Atheist_BG Wrote:

(January 10, 2017 at 11:26 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: How do you guys feel about a couple who, upon learning their unborn baby had a mental impairment such as Down Syndrome (or other)

I think abortion in this case is the better choice than giving life to such a child which is nothing else but a mockery with its future life. What kind of a mother would give life to a child in the full consciousness that this child won't have a normal life? That this child will most probably be bullied and ridiculed by the other kids because it's different? I'm not mentally impaired and yet I know what it is to be different and to be constantly bullied for that at school. But there's one difference - I fought back. While that kid won't have the mental capacity to fight back thus it will be like green light for all bullies. Does that kid really deserve such a life only because the selfishness of the mother and the fear to lose her offspring? Because of her selfishness and fear of the loss, that kid will have to spend the rest of its life in being the regular subject of ridicules and a punch bag for bullies.
I don't know about you but if I were a mother, I wouldn't do that to my kid.

Abortions off the table in this scenario

What people aren't getting is that the only reason any disabled persons life is hard is because able bodied make it that way.