Quote:+The Quran: heavenly word of God, revealed to humans through Prophet Mohammed in Arabic Language.

Of course, we only have your word for that.

Makes me want to re watch Lawrence of Arabia.

(April 20, 2017 at 5:52 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: Makes me want to re watch Lawrence of Arabia.

I prefer the prequel: "Smythe of London".

(April 20, 2017 at 5:39 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:+The Quran: heavenly word of God, revealed to humans through Prophet Mohammed in Arabic Language.

Of course, we only have your word for that.

IIRC, there are copies of the Quran older than the Prophet Mohammed's time, so we don't even have that, perhaps.

(April 20, 2017 at 5:39 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:+The Quran: heavenly word of God, revealed to humans through Prophet Mohammed in Arabic Language.

Of course, we only have your word for that.

It makes sense when it's read; it's consistent to utter levels.
The amounts of contradiction between it and the Hadith books is just scary.

 mh.brewer

Quote:Makes me want to re watch Lawrence of Arabia.

Lawrence knew how to play on the emotions of native Arabs:
1-The skin-color factor: he was blonde. That was enough to send many Bedwin natives in his tracks.
2-The hate for the Ottomans: the Turks became racists in their late days; they were even brutal before that with their impales. Crimes like enslaving Christian children does haunt the mind. It was a great civilization, but Rome was also great. Persia too; ancient Egypt too. 
3-The hate for one another: no need to read long articles. Just visit Arabia and see the hate yourself.

So Lawrence did his homework. One evil homework.
His Arab bodies weren't any better, they just needed the mind that would lead their armies.

The movie sucked. It was very long.

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Vorlon13

Dating him according to the Hadith is just wrong

Trying to get where that URL comes in when my comment to MH was tongue-in-cheek?

Quote:Dating him according to the Hadith is just wrong

Of course it is, but so what? The Q'ran is a hobbled together mishmash of older Jewish and Christian materials, and the ahadith were compiled and finalized so long after the death of Muhammed that they have about as much historical utility regarding him as Monmouth's 'History' has regarding King Arthur (that is, none to speak of).

Boru

An angel dictates the Koran to an illiterate merchant. What a load of bullshit. Why should I be impressed?

(April 20, 2017 at 5:31 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote:

I wanted to write about the current state of Islam; and what led to it through the past.

It's a repeated topic; told in different fashions, with utter inclinations towards certain beliefs and cults; more than I can imagine, but Muslims very a lot in terms of faith, an eye used to contradiction would just see fighting sects waiting for the next chaos to come and allow them to slaughter.

As on cult fights the other, treason happen, nationalism fails miserably, the Sykes-Picot agreement is an example, a more recent and obvious one is the Iraq war.

To understand the Muslim faith, we need to look at the following concepts carefully:

+The Quran: heavenly word of God, revealed to humans through Prophet Mohammed in Arabic Language. 

+The Hadith: the documentation of Prophet Mohammed's life after the revelation.

Through these 2, Islam is foretold. 

+I : I believe in the Quran only. I take whatever is inside the book, and neglect whatever is outside. I use evidence from inside the book itself.

+Sunni Muslims: They believe in certain narratorsof Hadith and believe in both Quran and Hadith written by the trusted writers

+Shiite Muslims: They believe in certain narrators of Hadith; and believe in both Quran and Hadith written by the trusted writers

Through Islamic history, bloody wars took place where Sunni, Shiite and other Muslim sects fought to the death, the Crusades for example used this weakness; the Ottoman empire fell due to the same weakness.

The Middle East might be a turmoil, but it's not the mere conspiracies of outer nations; the hearts of many Muslims are sick.

Hungry for ancient blood, instead of facing today's reality.

You like Christians and Jews and Hindus and Buddhists are still all in the same boat. 

The only thing I agree with is currently in today's global climate the East has the most problems because of religion, right now. Too much of it has not caught up with modern western pluralism, even Turkey looks to be having somewhat of a backslide into a  more authoritarian view. 

But WW2 German's Christians were brutal, and the Soviet Union Russian Orthodox Christians helped put Stalin in power.

You cant force any religion out of existence no, but religion itself is a horrible way of conducting political diplomacy. That is why Sunnis and Shiites fight. But to a lesser degree in America, it is why we also have political divisions between liberal Christians and conservative Christians. It is also why a Tibet Buddhist will not agree with a Chinese Buddhist.

And it is especially why Christians and Muslims cant get along, and why Jews and Muslims cant get along. There simply is no good way for 7 billion humans to filter politics through competing religions, nationally, regional or global politics. The west simply does a better job of keeping religion on a leash.