Nope the result would have been an emboldened group of Nazi fucks . And no stopping Nazi fucks is totally worth dying for . And also worth breaking a law over .

(August 18, 2017 at 10:56 am)Tizheruk Wrote: Nope the result would have been an emboldened group of Nazi fucks . And no stopping Nazi fucks is totally worth dying for . And also worth breaking a law over .

The non-emboldened nazi fuck just drove a car into a group of people.   The 'emboldened' nazi's had a tiki torch party.

My assumption's always been that most of the dangerous nazi's are too busy running drugs and guns and making millions to give a shit about statues.

(August 18, 2017 at 11:13 am)wallym Wrote:

(August 18, 2017 at 10:56 am)Tizheruk Wrote: Nope the result would have been an emboldened group of Nazi fucks . And no stopping Nazi fucks is totally worth dying for . And also worth breaking a law over .

The non-emboldened nazi fuck just drove a car into a group of people.   The 'emboldened' nazi's had a tiki torch party.

My assumption's always been that most of the dangerous nazi's are too busy running drugs and guns and making millions to give a shit about statues.

What the f does this mean? That made no sense at all. Hitler before he got into politics when he started his group were not capable of physical violence because he didn't have mass numbers when people started to take notice of him. But his rhetoric sold and that is what made it get to the point of violence.

And did you miss the point that there were assholes who showed up with weapons who supported the night rally? The night rally were still shouting white nationalism regardless. The day protesters were still embolden by the night rally. "Look, they did it, we can do it too."

"Non emboldened" my ass. If someone didn't plant that hate in him he wouldn't have done it so he most certainly had influence.

---

This bullshit dodge misses the point that our politics is far different this time. This time you have a politician pandering to that hate.

(August 18, 2017 at 10:50 am)wallym Wrote: Maybe the both sides issue, was that the counter protesters were physically assaulting people?  I get the notion that we like seeing nazi or nazi like people getting punched, but that doesn't make it legal.  It's basically vigilantism, and escalates a situation in which one side is filled with crazy people many of them with guns.  I'm shocked more people haven't been murdered at these things, but that just goes to show how big of a non-factor most of these nazi types are.  

Hitler and his ilk had a country and a massive army they tried to take over the world with.  These guys have 30 somethings who work in a hot dog store that are mostly scared of a physical confrontation.

My thoughts on the lady getting killed is what a waste it was.  The outcome of Charlottesville with no 'counter protesters standing up to evil' was they marched with their little tiki torches.  Nobody cares.  Town removes statue instead of them.  And back they go to pizza shops and hotdog stores.

Losing your life over a perceived symbolic victory doesn't seem like a good tradeoff.

The do-nothing theory of civic engagement doesn't have a stellar track record, particularly when nazis are involved.  Fun fact, when the nazis started out they inflated their membership by adding digits to their silly little cards...they did this because there weren't very many of them.  

I wonder how many do nothings later served the Wehrmacht or provided material support to the SS?  

There will never be a moment when you or anyone else, in defending nazis for any reason or by any means, absolutely least of which "hur dur scary leftists were hitting nazis with sticks"....will be on the right side of this one. Good, nazis should be hit with sticks. If our government refuses to handle the nazi issue, and our president shows himself to be a nazi apologist..there;s very little else to do -but- hit nazis with sticks until they crawl back under whatever rock they came from. They can take their statues with them, by all means. The height of irony, at least recently, simply has to be a bunch of racist shitlords calling for the oppression of other peoples in a comical show of "force" then pissing and bitching and whining about The Man holding them down, when The Man failed to hold them down, which is The Man's job...in the first place. Some Master Race, menaced by a bunch of limp wristed liberal race traitors...who, confronted with disgust levied at them and their position and their actions.....manage to squeak out themselves and through their proxies and even by unwitting but useful idiots...that in the face of their bullshit, people should be civil...to them....

(August 18, 2017 at 12:12 pm)Khemikal Wrote:

(August 18, 2017 at 10:50 am)wallym Wrote: Maybe the both sides issue, was that the counter protesters were physically assaulting people?  I get the notion that we like seeing nazi or nazi like people getting punched, but that doesn't make it legal.  It's basically vigilantism, and escalates a situation in which one side is filled with crazy people many of them with guns.  I'm shocked more people haven't been murdered at these things, but that just goes to show how big of a non-factor most of these nazi types are.  

Hitler and his ilk had a country and a massive army they tried to take over the world with.  These guys have 30 somethings who work in a hot dog store that are mostly scared of a physical confrontation.

My thoughts on the lady getting killed is what a waste it was.  The outcome of Charlottesville with no 'counter protesters standing up to evil' was they marched with their little tiki torches.  Nobody cares.  Town removes statue instead of them.  And back they go to pizza shops and hotdog stores.

Losing your life over a perceived symbolic victory doesn't seem like a good tradeoff.

The do-nothing theory of civic engagement doesn't have a stellar track record, particularly when nazis are involved.  Fun fact, when the nazis started out they inflated their membership by adding digits to their silly little cards...they did this because there weren't very many of them.  

I wonder how many do nothings later served the Wehrmacht or provided material support to the SS?  

There will never be a moment when you or anyone else, in defending nazis for any reason or by any means, absolutely least of which "hur dur scary leftists were hitting nazis with sticks"....will be on the right side of this one.  Good, nazis should be hit with sticks.  If our government refuses to handle the nazi issue, and our president shows himself to be a nazi apologist..there;s very little else to do -but- hit nazis with sticks until they crawl back under whatever rock they came from.  They can take their statues with them, by all means.  The height of irony, at least recently, simply has to be a bunch of racist shitlords calling for the oppression of other peoples in a comical show of "force" then pissing and bitching and whining about The Man holding them down, when The Man failed to hold them down, which is The Man's job...in the first place.  Some Master Race, menaced by a bunch of limp wristed liberal race traitors...who, confronted with disgust levied at them and their position and their actions.....manage to squeak out themselves and through their proxies and even by unwitting but useful idiots...that in the face of their bullshit, people should be civil...to them....

Yep just like 45 lying about the vote margin, EC margin, and inauguration turnout and his Twitter followers.

I think maybe this all stems from the need for people to feel they are doing something with their lives? We're pretty much a drone society. We go make our widgets get our food and then watch our tv. If we die, it doesn't really matter too much. The machine rolls on. But at the same time, we're buried under platitudes from birth. Make the most of yourself. Be the change you want to see in the world. And on and on...

So we've got all these unimportant people who want to believe they are important. Well, you can't be important if you're nemesis is some hot dog guy and a statue depicting events from 150 years ago. So people create this weird delusion, that it's not just some dipshit hotdog maker with dumb ideas. It might just be Hitler's reincarnation...and if we don't stop him from a rally to stop taking down a statue, a rally which was unlikely to have any impact on the removal of the statue, why, what's next? The reinstitution of slavery!? Nazi Rule in America?

It's all kind of silly, but people have invested so much of who they are into this stuff, that there's no turning back now. It is people's personal identity to be the 'good guy fighting evil.' Even if being the good guy just involves sending out a tweet, or sucker punching some dipshit, and evil is a moron who makes hot dogs for a living.

It's such trivial nonsense that has been elevated to this grand endeavor.

Way to justify doing nothing in the face of racism, Wally. Very impressive.

(August 18, 2017 at 3:53 pm)wallym Wrote: I think maybe this all stems from the need for people to feel they are doing something with their lives?  We're pretty much a drone society.  We go make our widgets get our food and then watch our tv.  If we die, it doesn't really matter too much.  The machine rolls on.  But at the same time, we're buried under platitudes from birth.  Make the most of yourself.  Be the change you want to see in the world.  And on and on...

So we've got all these unimportant people who want to believe they are important.  Well, you can't be important if you're nemesis is some hot dog guy and a statue depicting events from 150 years ago.  So people create this weird delusion, that it's not just some dipshit hotdog maker with dumb ideas.  It might just be Hitler's reincarnation...and if we don't stop him from a rally to stop taking down a statue, a rally which was unlikely to have any impact on the removal of the statue, why, what's next?  The reinstitution of slavery!?  Nazi Rule in America?  

It's all kind of silly, but people have invested so much of who they are into this stuff, that there's no turning back now.  It is people's personal identity to be the 'good guy fighting evil.'  Even if being the good guy just involves sending out a tweet, or sucker punching some dipshit, and evil is a moron who makes hot dogs for a living.

It's such trivial nonsense that has been elevated to this grand endeavor.

So saying the Nazis and KKK were bad is "silly"? Wow, damned glad the allies thought that and didn't invade Normandy. Damned glad MLK threw up his hands and said, "Fuck it, why is it my business if whites hate us?"

You still don't get it. We are not talking about say a half dozen no name assholes here, we are talking about American Nazis and KKK involved in voting and in politics and this time around they have a friend in the White House who is not being unambiguous about it. WE ALREADY HAD JIM CROW. WE ALREADY HAD SEGREGATION, WE ALREADY HAD A MAJORITY OF  KKK MEMBERS IN CONGRESS.....<------YES ASSHOLE at one time in the 1920s a majority of or congress were KKK members. If you don't think history can repeat itself, you are a fool.

And damn, again, NOBODY is talking about erasing history. Just taking the hero worship out of those monuments by moving them to museums and history books.

Nations are built out of a mass of faceless, nameless nobodies taking tiny steps and bitching about the rations and the march the whole way.  If those faceless, nameless peons are goose-steeping, you get the reich.  If they're making their seemingly insignificant contributions to literally anything better than thaat..you end up with something immeasurably better than the reich.

(August 18, 2017 at 4:03 pm)Brian37 Wrote:

(August 18, 2017 at 3:53 pm)wallym Wrote: I think maybe this all stems from the need for people to feel they are doing something with their lives?  We're pretty much a drone society.  We go make our widgets get our food and then watch our tv.  If we die, it doesn't really matter too much.  The machine rolls on.  But at the same time, we're buried under platitudes from birth.  Make the most of yourself.  Be the change you want to see in the world.  And on and on...

So we've got all these unimportant people who want to believe they are important.  Well, you can't be important if you're nemesis is some hot dog guy and a statue depicting events from 150 years ago.  So people create this weird delusion, that it's not just some dipshit hotdog maker with dumb ideas.  It might just be Hitler's reincarnation...and if we don't stop him from a rally to stop taking down a statue, a rally which was unlikely to have any impact on the removal of the statue, why, what's next?  The reinstitution of slavery!?  Nazi Rule in America?  

It's all kind of silly, but people have invested so much of who they are into this stuff, that there's no turning back now.  It is people's personal identity to be the 'good guy fighting evil.'  Even if being the good guy just involves sending out a tweet, or sucker punching some dipshit, and evil is a moron who makes hot dogs for a living.

It's such trivial nonsense that has been elevated to this grand endeavor.

So saying the Nazis and KKK were bad is "silly"? Wow, damned glad the allies thought that and didn't invade Normandy. Damned glad MLK threw up his hands and said, "Fuck it, why is it my business if whites hate us?"

You still don't get it. We are not talking about say a half dozen no name assholes here, we are talking about American Nazis and KKK involved in voting and in politics and this time around they have a friend in the White House who is not being unambiguous about it. WE ALREADY HAD JIM CROW. WE ALREADY HAD SEGREGATION, WE ALREADY HAD A MAJORITY OF  KKK MEMBERS IN CONGRESS.....<------YES ASSHOLE at one time in the 1920s a majority of or congress were KKK members. If you don't think history can repeat itself, you are a fool.

And damn, again, NOBODY is talking about erasing history. Just taking the hero worship out of those monuments by moving them to museums and history books.

They're arguing over a statue.  And the side that's supposed to be a major threat, the KKK/Nazi's, with, you claim, the President of the United States, a Republican Congress, and a Republican Supreme Court in their court aren't winning.  

With the deck stacked fully in their favor, they can't win an argument over keeping a statue up.  And you're worried they're a threat to what?  It's so comically absurd, that the face of this huge existential threat to our nation worked in a hot dog shop.  AND lost his job for showing up to the rally, so I guess you're battling an unemployed hot dog maker.

Dealing with the seriously dangerous KKK/Nazi's is a job for the FBI/Police.  Escalating these situations with pansy Nazi wannabes via vigilantism is just going to get people hurt/killed to achieve a result that's already been achieved.