Perhaps seeing a mental health counselor will help put some things into perspective for you. I hope you get some peace from this soon. No one should have to live like this.

They are the least people who can help me, they won't understand, I see things clearly the past to now, is no longer obscure. I know the track I was on and I know I must continue to do what I set myself out to do.

They will like you tell me I was a kid. There is no changing it but they don't believe in scolding the soul, they just try to help us cope, I don't want to cope, I want it erased from my book of deeds, I don't care if I have to cry a lot and laugh little, not enjoy food as much as I use to, I don't care what I have to do, but I will make Satan and his forces regret inspiring me with that deed as a kid, I will make them regret it when I live a life trying to enlighten human beings and help them, and I will redeem myself in all that and it doesn't matter, I know I can't laugh as much as I use to when I forgot. I know I will never see my self like I use to.

But I don't want to accept myself. I don't want their analysis of all the good I've done which always mixed with Worship of the dark enemy to humanity and valuing his identity linked to me as just as important as God.

I can't act out of love for myself anymore, it must be love of God and his chosen ones.

(January 8, 2018 at 2:57 am)vulcanlogician Wrote: What's up with this?

It's the first step in the ABCs of becoming a Christian (Admit, Believe, Confess) but I always saw it as a rather unhealthy way to reflect upon one's misdeeds. Personally, I think something like "I made a mistake" or "That was terrible of me to do" is a much more beneficial as it is directed toward the action itself. It doesn't make the assumption: I did a bad thing, therefore I'm a bad person. 

What does it really even mean? 

Admit that I'm capable of moral transgressions? Sure, I'll admit that. But that doesn't mean I am anything, does it? 

Does it mean admit that I've commited moral transgressions in the past? I'll admit that too. And while you're at it, I'll probably fail in my moral responsibilities in the future too. I admit it.


Theists: Have I admitted in this post that I'm a sinner? Or is there more to it than that? If so, what's the difference?

Atheists: What do you make of all this "admit you're a sinner" stuff? What do you think motivates it? Is it a good, bad, or ugly way to reflect on moral transgressions?

It is a power play, no more and no less.

Once one "admits one is a sinner" suddenly the prospect of insta-forgiveness is proffered if only you accept jebus/spaghetti monster/lego as your deity.

It is a cosmological bribe with no basis in fact. The ultimate guilt trip.

(January 13, 2018 at 8:16 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: They are the least people who can help me, they won't understand, I see things clearly the past to now, is no longer obscure. I know the track I was on and I know I must continue to do what I set myself out to do.

They will like you tell me I was a kid. There is no changing it but they don't believe in scolding the soul, they just try to help us cope, I don't want to cope, I want it erased from my book of deeds, I don't care if I have to cry a lot and laugh little, not enjoy food as much as I use to, I don't care what I have to do, but I will make Satan and his forces regret inspiring me with that deed as a kid, I will make them regret it when I live a life trying to enlighten human beings and help them, and I will redeem myself in all that and it doesn't matter, I know I can't laugh as much as I use to when I forgot. I know I will never see my self like I use to.

But I don't want to accept myself. I don't want their analysis of all the good I've done which always mixed with Worship of the dark enemy to humanity and valuing his identity linked to me as just as important as God.

I can't act out of love for myself anymore, it must be love of God and his chosen ones.

God forgives instantly and completely for any and all actions so long as there is true remorse. There is no doubt in my mind that you feel truly sorry for whatever it was you did. I think you need to trust in God's love and mercy and move on. He does not want you to feel this way about yourself.

(January 13, 2018 at 10:00 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(January 13, 2018 at 8:16 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: They are the least people who can help me, they won't understand, I see things clearly the past to now, is no longer obscure.  I know the track I was on and I know I must continue to do what I set myself out to do.

They will like you tell me I was a kid. There is no changing it but they don't believe in scolding the soul, they just try to help us cope, I don't want to cope, I want it erased from my book of deeds, I don't care if I have to cry a lot and laugh little, not enjoy food as much as I use to, I don't care what I have to do, but I will make Satan and his forces regret inspiring me with that deed as a kid, I will make them regret it when I live a life trying to enlighten human beings and help them, and I will redeem myself in all that and it doesn't matter, I know I can't laugh as much as I use to when I forgot. I know I will never see my self like I use to.

But I don't want to accept myself. I don't want their analysis of all the good I've done which always mixed with Worship of the dark enemy to humanity and valuing his identity linked to me as just as important as God.

I can't act out of love for myself anymore, it must be love of God and his chosen ones.

God forgives instantly and completely for any and all actions so long as there is true remorse. There is no doubt in my mind that you feel truly sorry for whatever it was you did. I think you need to trust in God's love and mercy and move on. He does not want you to feel this way about yourself.

MK does not believe that.

(January 13, 2018 at 8:16 pm)Abaddon_ire Wrote: It is a power play, no more and no less.

Once one "admits one is a sinner" suddenly the prospect of insta-forgiveness is proffered if only you accept jebus/spaghetti monster/lego as your deity.

It is a cosmological bribe with no basis in fact. The ultimate guilt trip.

Sin covers offenses against oneself, against another and against God. Sin is defied by the ten laws of God, six of which apply to human relationships.
I just wonder which ones your country can do without?

Are you trying to say that there is no such thing as sin?

MK, unless you caused real, actual harm to someone else (and I mean real, like mutilating their pet, committing sexual assault, shoving them down a well or in front of oncoming traffic), you're overblowing it. And even if you did something along those lines, beating yourself up over it now isn't helpful.

Here's the thing - adults don't give passes to children because they're inherently good.  They do so because they're inherently innocent.  They lack both knowledge and experience, and must have consistent guidance.  Trying to hold your child self responsible for 'evil' as an adult is utterly unhealthy.

You keep claiming you see things clearly now, but I 100% don't buy it.  I see a broken, miserable young man that's turned to religion in order to justify the negative feelings he has for himself.  Someone who's afraid of forgiveness and joy because he thinks he's not worthy of it, and that allowing himself such small comforts will lead to something worse.

People have remarked and questioned about your old self.  The guy who was going to school, who was trying to make a future for himself.  This new version of you is, frankly, fucked up.  And I'm not saying that for a cheap kudos or to be insulting.  Something very obviously broke in you, and you (naturally) turned to your religion for help.  The problem is that, instead, it's had a feedback effect.

You're now at the point where you think whatever you did as a kid - and I'm all but sure it wasn't actually a big deal - would've been worthy of suicide.  That religious penance, to the point of not even enjoying food, is the only answer all these years later.

That.  Is.  Fucked.  Up.

From one human to another, I implore that you seek help.  Real help, not a deeper dive into the poison.

Original sin suggests we are a sinner/bad person because Adam and Eve fucked up. Which makes the whole concept of sin even more retarded. It's not just that our bad behavior=we are bad people.... it's that other people's bad behavior makes us bad people.

And more than that, other people's bad behavior=disobeying god.

So.... we are bad people because an imaginary being told some imaginary people who never existed to not do something and they did it anyway.


Errrr.... I think the only theists that care about being logical eventually become atheists.

(January 13, 2018 at 10:13 pm)Abaddon_ire Wrote:

(January 13, 2018 at 10:00 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: God forgives instantly and completely for any and all actions so long as there is true remorse. There is no doubt in my mind that you feel truly sorry for whatever it was you did. I think you need to trust in God's love and mercy and move on. He does not want you to feel this way about yourself.

MK does not believe that.

She knows me better than you do, and I agree with what she stated. I just hope I am truly remorseful not out of my ego being hurt but out love of the person I wronged and that love being love of the face of God in that person.  I hope it gives me resolve to change the path I set myself to and the darkness that I been immersed in and arrogance that you guys witness from me as well with uncompassionate non-humble egoistic self-worshiping tone I have.

(January 14, 2018 at 2:21 am)Hammy Wrote: Original sin suggests we are a sinner/bad person because Adam and Eve fucked up. Which makes the whole concept of sin even more retarded. It's not just that our bad behavior=we are bad people.... it's that other people's bad behavior makes us bad people.

And more than that, other people's bad behavior=disobeying god.

So.... we are bad people because an imaginary being told some imaginary people who never existed to not do something and they did it anyway.


Errrr.... I think the only theists that care about being logical eventually become atheists.

You are quite right about original sin - it is nonsense.
Original sin is a Catholic doctrine, which the church imbibed from pagan sources, but the Bible does not teach it.
You cannot be guilty of someone else's thought or action, unless you participated in it, and you can only be held accountable if you had knowledge of what you were doing.

I'm sure you would agree that if we deliberately, or through neglect, hurt ourselves or others, we are breaking the laws which nurture life - a physical and undeniable reality.

It may be assumed that no one has any obligation towards life, if it is just an accident by molecules, in which case it would be difficult to convince anyone of obligation and accountability, wouldn't it?