(April 28, 2018 at 6:42 pm)Losty Wrote: I think it should be illegal to preform on children. If someone wants it they can get it done as an adult.

You can ask Valk. She'd probably agree. It's more reasonable done on an infant who won't have any memory of the pain. An adult WILL have memory of the pain, wishing his parents had been smart enough to have it done when he was an infant.

(April 28, 2018 at 6:34 pm)henryp Wrote:

(April 28, 2018 at 5:42 pm)LastPoet Wrote: My mom taught me how to do my higiene in the uncircuncised peen.

But this is more cultural to the US than religious (barring jews). In Portugal that procedure is only used in children of dire need, like a closed prepuce or infection.

My wife wanted as a tradition to pierce the ears of Sofia, because "girls look nice with earrings" and "its less painful while she is young". No fucking way and over my stone cold deadbody. She will have the piercings she want when she grows old enough to be able to pay for those. Otherwise, I do not own my daughter. She is mine only in the sense that I have the responsability to care for her until she grows wings to fly on her own.

I guess if it were a tradition on the US, the clit snip would be acceptable, as it makes women more "pure", huh?

Out of curiosity, where do you draw the line?

Orthodontics? haircuts? fingernails?  

Haircuts and fingernails are the most extreme examples I can think of of a parent not wanting to alter their child's body.  I'd assume that doesn't apply, but you never know.

Braces for their teeth though, I'd be curious on.  Having metal glued to all their teeth, and then wires fed through, and slowly tightened over the course of several years, permanently reshaping your jaw and teeth though...along with the substantial discomfort it causes.  That seems in the ballpark of pierced ears and circumcision?

I think that getting braces for a 10 year old, with their consent, is completely different from circumcising a baby who cannot possibly consent.

---

(April 28, 2018 at 6:45 pm)Lutrinae Wrote:

(April 28, 2018 at 6:42 pm)Losty Wrote: I think it should be illegal to preform on children. If someone wants it they can get it done as an adult.

You can ask Valk.  She'd probably agree.  It's more reasonable done on an infant who won't have any memory of the pain.  An adult WILL have memory of the pain, wishing his parents had been smart enough to have it done when he was an infant.

Why can't the adult get it done under a local or general anesthetic?

Perhaps that can be done.

(April 28, 2018 at 6:46 pm)Alexmahone Wrote:

(April 28, 2018 at 6:34 pm)henryp Wrote: Out of curiosity, where do you draw the line?

Orthodontics? haircuts? fingernails?  

Haircuts and fingernails are the most extreme examples I can think of of a parent not wanting to alter their child's body.  I'd assume that doesn't apply, but you never know.

Braces for their teeth though, I'd be curious on.  Having metal glued to all their teeth, and then wires fed through, and slowly tightened over the course of several years, permanently reshaping your jaw and teeth though...along with the substantial discomfort it causes.  That seems in the ballpark of pierced ears and circumcision?

I think that getting braces for a 10 year old, with their consent, is completely different from circumcising a baby who cannot possibly consent.

---

(April 28, 2018 at 6:45 pm)Lutrinae Wrote: You can ask Valk.  She'd probably agree.  It's more reasonable done on an infant who won't have any memory of the pain.  An adult WILL have memory of the pain, wishing his parents had been smart enough to have it done when he was an infant.

Why can't the adult get it done under a local or general anesthetic?

I don't think a 10yo can give real consent.  I don't think consent is required either.  Do you think a 10yo should be able to refuse orthodontics?  That's an interesting idea.  Can a 10yo refuse a flu shot?

Regarding waiting until adulthood, you lose out on a lot of the non-aesthetic benefits.  The American Association of Pediatrics (or something like that) says the medical benefits outweigh the risks, for example.  So it's not merely a whim of religious folks or wanting a them to have a prettier dick.

(April 28, 2018 at 7:00 pm)henryp Wrote:

(April 28, 2018 at 6:46 pm)Alexmahone Wrote: I think that getting braces for a 10 year old, with their consent, is completely different from circumcising a baby who cannot possibly consent.

---

Why can't the adult get it done under a local or general anesthetic?

I don't think a 10yo can give real consent.  I don't think consent is required either.  Do you think a 10yo should be able to refuse orthodontics?  That's an interesting idea.  Can a 10yo refuse a flu shot?

Regarding waiting until adulthood, you lose out on a lot of the non-aesthetic benefits.  The American Association of Pediatrics (or something like that) says the medical benefits outweigh the risks, for example.  So it's not merely a whim of religious folks or wanting a them to have a prettier dick.

There's a general consensus that flu shots and orthodontics are necessary or at least do more good than harm. This isn't the case with circumcision except in certain cases.

Doctor's recommend prescribe orthodontics and flu shots, not usually circumcision.

henryp Wrote:Do you think a 10yo should be able to refuse orthodontics?

Absolutely.

Quote:Can a 10yo refuse a flu shot?

They ought to be able to.

Unless there is an imminent life-threatening situation, I don't like the idea of using physical force against children.

(April 28, 2018 at 7:12 pm)The Industrial Atheist Wrote: There's a general consensus that flu shots and orthodontics are necessary or at least do more good than harm. This isn't the case with circumcision except in certain cases.

In what way? Please, by all means, be specific.

(April 28, 2018 at 7:12 pm)The Industrial Atheist Wrote:

(April 28, 2018 at 7:00 pm)henryp Wrote: I don't think a 10yo can give real consent.  I don't think consent is required either.  Do you think a 10yo should be able to refuse orthodontics?  That's an interesting idea.  Can a 10yo refuse a flu shot?

Regarding waiting until adulthood, you lose out on a lot of the non-aesthetic benefits.  The American Association of Pediatrics (or something like that) says the medical benefits outweigh the risks, for example.  So it's not merely a whim of religious folks or wanting a them to have a prettier dick.

There's a general consensus that flu shots and orthodontics are necessary or at least do more good than harm. This isn't the case with circumcision except in certain cases.

Doctor's recommend prescribe orthodontics and flu shots, not usually circumcision.

After a comprehensive review of the scientific evidence, the American Academy of Pediatrics found the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks, but the benefits are not great enough to recommend universal newborn circumcision. The AAP policy statement published Monday, August 27, says the final decision should still be left to parents to make in the context of their religious, ethical and cultural beliefs. 

The entire position: 
http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/130/3/585

So it's basically 50/50.

Quote: Dick ends don't.

The do get elected president on occasion, though.