(May 16, 2018 at 1:24 pm)CDF47 Wrote:

(May 16, 2018 at 1:21 pm)Abaddon_ire Wrote: No that ship has sailed. You have nailed your colours to the mast. Too late to back out now.

I know exactly what you are and it is not a pretty picture. 

You do not dedicate yourself to a god of love, but rather a god of hate and bile. 

You have hinted at such for a long time, but now you have painted the picture. 

You are done.

Just saying, I did not intend to put you down is all.  That is the truth.  We all sin.  I sure haven't been perfect in my life.

God hates evil and I hate evil.  That is the only hatred God has.  I try to make that my only hatred as well but I struggle in my heart because I am a sinner.

You have called me and my family sinners worthy of death for simply existing. You don't care how difficult it is for a trans person to get on in the world, you have stated that it would be moral to kill such a person. You have stated that this is what your god wants. And that you are OK with such a course of action.

Now that you learn that my eldest is trans-gender, you find your only route is to try to back out of the scumbaggery you already espoused as though it never happened. What to be scandalised further? My eldest is girl to boy transgender, and is dating a boy to girl transgender person. No biggy to me.

You want to kill both of them.

You are a horrible person. Live with it.

(May 16, 2018 at 1:35 pm)CDF47 Wrote:

(May 16, 2018 at 1:30 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote: How does his "spiritual control" work?
What are the mechanisms and where is the evidence for these mechanisms?
You say he holds every molecule together. How?

You say somethings are "the mysteries of the lord", is this the same as saying you don't know?

That is a mystery.  He is in control of every molecule in the universe.  We are sinners in the hand of an angry God but a loving God as well.

Science shows we were created.  His handiwork can be seen in the cell and in the creation of the universe and in people.

Because He is almighty.

Some things I do not know.  They are mysteries.  The Lord is a mysterious Lord.

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(May 16, 2018 at 1:32 pm)Kit Wrote: Poppycock!

Truth!

Nope!

(May 16, 2018 at 1:15 pm)CDF47 Wrote: Science supports that the universe and living systems are created so I am right on this one. 

The trouble, here..is not with the article of your faith above.

The trouble is that assuming science -does- support creation.....it doesn;t support ID.  If the universe -is- created, ID -is not- an accurate comment on that act of creation or any of it;s indicating observations.  Specified complexity is a failed hypothesis.  Irreducible complexity is a failed hypothesis.  If god did what you think god did...god did it some other way.

You think that you're arguing for the articles of your faith, but you're not. Your arguing for two failed hypothesis as thought they -were- your faith. In the process, you discredit your own faith for no reason whatsoever.

Do you understand?

(May 16, 2018 at 1:15 pm)CDF47 Wrote: His divine plan of who is saved and who is not.  The mysteries of the Lord.  He has and can manifest Himself as He wills.
He spiritually is in control of everything.  He holds every molecule of the world together.

By claiming that it is god's divine plan to design a world where every living thing exists at the expense of some other living thing, on a planet where there is no place we can go without encountering something with the potential to take our life, where that which is good to us is bad for us, and we are forbidden to perform the most basic physical act of our existence. You argue for design at the expense of intelligent.

(May 16, 2018 at 1:38 pm)Abaddon_ire Wrote:

(May 16, 2018 at 1:24 pm)CDF47 Wrote: Just saying, I did not intend to put you down is all.  That is the truth.  We all sin.  I sure haven't been perfect in my life.

God hates evil and I hate evil.  That is the only hatred God has.  I try to make that my only hatred as well but I struggle in my heart because I am a sinner.

You have called me and my family sinners worthy of death for simply existing. You don't care how difficult it is for a trans person to get on in the world, you have stated that it would be moral to kill such a person. You have stated that this is what your god wants. And that you are OK with such a course of action.

Now that you learn that my eldest is trans-gender, you find your only route is to try to back out of the scumbaggery you already espoused as though it never happened. What to be scandalised further? My eldest is girl to boy transgender, and is dating a boy to girl transgender person. No biggy to me.

You want to kill both of them.

You are a horrible person. Live with it.

Being sinners is the ultimate truth.  

I didn't say we should kill him. That was an OT law which is not in affect in the US.  The Lord lets the governments of the world make the laws of the land.  If believe it is sinful though and he should repent.

Sounds like you're pissy that god makes some people different.  Whats the matter, don;t like his Grand Plan™?  Does it make you feel icky to have to share the world with gods other created creatures as he created them?

If there -is- a good god, I bet it can;t stand people like you. Food for thought.

(May 16, 2018 at 1:40 pm)Khemikal Wrote:

(May 16, 2018 at 1:15 pm)CDF47 Wrote: Science supports that the universe and living systems are created so I am right on this one. 

The trouble, here..is not with the article of your faith above.

The trouble is that assuming science -does- support creation.....it doesn;t support ID.  If the universe -is- created, ID -is not- an accurate comment on that act of creation or any of it;s indicating observations.  Specified complexity is a failed hypothesis.  Irreducible complexity is a failed hypothesis.  If god did what you think god did...god did it some other way.

You think that you're arguing for the articles of your faith, but you're not.  Your arguing for two failed hypothesis as thought they -were- your faith.  In the process, you discredit your own faith for no reason whatsoever.

Do you understand?

I know what you are saying and I disagree to a high degree.  There is definitely highly complex and specific information inside DNA which could only come from a mind.  It was created as I stated in my OP.  The universe is designed because it is fine-tuned and super-symmetrical.  The universe had a beginning because of the Big Bang Theory.  I still believe irreducible complexity does exist in molecular machines too.  

The information in DNA, the molecular machines in and on the cells, and the fine-tuned universe which had a beginning are my strongest points.

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(May 16, 2018 at 1:45 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote:

(May 16, 2018 at 1:15 pm)CDF47 Wrote: His divine plan of who is saved and who is not.  The mysteries of the Lord.  He has and can manifest Himself as He wills.
He spiritually is in control of everything.  He holds every molecule of the world together.

By claiming that it is god's divine plan to design a world where every living thing exists at the expense of some other living thing, on a planet where there is no place we can go without encountering something with the potential to take our life, where that which is good to us is bad for us, and we are forbidden to perform the most basic physical act of our existence.  You argue for design at the expense of intelligent.

Science proves design.  After that I turn to theology and I believe in the Christian God of the Bible.

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(May 16, 2018 at 1:47 pm)Khemikal Wrote: Sounds like you're pissy that god makes some people different.  Whats the matter, don;t like his Grand Plan™?  Does it make you feel icky to have to share the world with gods other created creatures as he created them?

If there -is- a good god, I bet it can;t stand people like you.  Food for thought.

I am not pissy about anything.  His plan is His plan.  The only thing I can do about that is pray.  Sometimes.

Not sure why you would say that.

(May 16, 2018 at 1:45 pm)CDF47 Wrote:

(May 16, 2018 at 1:38 pm)Abaddon_ire Wrote: You have called me and my family sinners worthy of death for simply existing. You don't care how difficult it is for a trans person to get on in the world, you have stated that it would be moral to kill such a person. You have stated that this is what your god wants. And that you are OK with such a course of action.

Now that you learn that my eldest is trans-gender, you find your only route is to try to back out of the scumbaggery you already espoused as though it never happened. What to be scandalised further? My eldest is girl to boy transgender, and is dating a boy to girl transgender person. No biggy to me.

You want to kill both of them.

You are a horrible person. Live with it.

Being sinners is the ultimate truth.  

I didn't say we should kill him. That was an OT law which is not in affect in the US.  The Lord lets the governments of the world make the laws of the land.  If believe it is sinful though and he should repent.

I am part of the other 95% of humanity that is not american nor lives in the US. So you can shove that nonsense. I  am a citizen AND resident  of the first country in the world to ratify SSM by popular vote. A matter of which I am proud.

When my eldest dropped the bombshell and finally came out as trans, I can quote my response...

Quote:I have known for years that you would be somewhere on the LGBTQ spectrum, it was merely a matter of where. I don't much care about that. You are your very own person. Some people will try and take that from you. Don't let them. I will help you to stop them. My love for you has no conditions.

You know, the kind of thing your god is unable to do.

(May 16, 2018 at 1:50 pm)CDF47 Wrote:

(May 16, 2018 at 1:40 pm)Khemikal Wrote: The trouble, here..is not with the article of your faith above.

The trouble is that assuming science -does- support creation.....it doesn;t support ID.  If the universe -is- created, ID -is not- an accurate comment on that act of creation or any of it;s indicating observations.  Specified complexity is a failed hypothesis.  Irreducible complexity is a failed hypothesis.  If god did what you think god did...god did it some other way.

You think that you're arguing for the articles of your faith, but you're not.  Your arguing for two failed hypothesis as thought they -were- your faith.  In the process, you discredit your own faith for no reason whatsoever.

Do you understand?

I know what you are saying and I disagree to a high degree. 

Your disagreement is irrelevant.  Both hypotheses failed to pass the most basic test.  This isn;t up for debate.  It's a simple yes/no on/off situation.  

Quote:There is definitely highly complex and specific information inside DNA which could only come from a mind. 

This is demonstrably untrue even if god -did- create the universe..again.

Quote:It was created as I stated in my OP. 

You believe it was created, I know..but you have no idea how and ID offers no insight whatsoever on that count.

Quote:The universe is designed because it is fine-tuned and super-symmetrical. 

Batshit claims, but irrellevent to why and how ID fails....so I don;t care.

Quote:The universe had a beginning because of the Big Bang Theory. 

More batshit claims, also irrelevant to how ID fails..again I don;t care.

Quote:I still believe irreducible complexity does exist in molecular machines too.  

Your beliefs have no effect on the fact of the matter.  

Quote:The information in DNA, the molecular machines in and on the cells, and the fine-tuned universe which had a beginning are my strongest points.

That's unfortunate, since both are failed hypotheses.  It would seem to me that your faith in god should be your strongest point...but your faith in god is looking more and more like faith in failed hypotheses. That;s poorly misinformed scientism, not christianity. Maybe -you- need to repent?

If your god created the universe, and life, he did it some other way.  Your two "strongest points" fail to describe however that was done or however we might determine that it was done. If you positively -insist- that your god is ID God..you have disproven your god.

Do you understand?

(May 16, 2018 at 1:56 pm)Abaddon_ire Wrote:

(May 16, 2018 at 1:45 pm)CDF47 Wrote: Being sinners is the ultimate truth.  

I didn't say we should kill him. That was an OT law which is not in affect in the US.  The Lord lets the governments of the world make the laws of the land.  If believe it is sinful though and he should repent.

I am part of the other 95% of humanity that is not american nor lives in the US. So you can shove that nonsense. I  am a citizen AND resident  of the first country in the world to ratify SSM by popular vote. A matter of which I am proud.

When my eldest dropped the bombshell and finally came out as trans, I can quote my response...

Quote:I have known for years that you would be somewhere on the LGBTQ spectrum, it was merely a matter of where. I don't much care about that. You are your very own person. Some people will try and take that from you. Don't let them. I will help you to stop them. My love for you has no conditions.

You know, the kind of thing your god is unable to do.

I understand.  I told you my take on it.  I don't hold any grudges against you or your son personally.