(October 28, 2018 at 6:44 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Ah, the "Let's make that shit up" school of theology.

Can there even theoretically be another School?

(October 28, 2018 at 2:39 am)CDF47 Wrote: Not always no.  Science is way too political for that.

And a bunch of hucksters promising you shit that can’t ever exist to be delivered in return for your devotion to the maintenance of their ability to remain influential well off parasite would result in something less political.

(October 27, 2018 at 8:50 pm)CDF47 Wrote:

(October 27, 2018 at 8:42 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: Are you doubting Bishop Ussher's calculations?  Even if we add a humongous fudge factor you still don't get an earth that is billions of years old.

So I'll ask you again, what do you base your belief in an old earth upon, and how do you reconcile it with the bible?

I believe Adam and Eve lived about 200,000 - 400,000 years ago in the Middle East.  I believe the generations highlighted in the Bible are just that "highlights."  I believe after the flood, the dates are more recent.

Okay, let's take that as a baseline. Genesis states that Adam and Eve were created on the sixth day. Let's assume they were created at the end of the day, and to allow for the indeterminacy of the length of a day to God, let's say that a day to God is not 1,000 years, but 100,000 years, to err by two orders of magnitude. That still leaves us with an earth that was created less than a million years ago. So where are you getting this 4 billion years shit from?

(October 28, 2018 at 9:11 am)Jörmungandr Wrote:  So where are you getting this 4 billion years shit from?

"ex Rectum"

@Bucky:

Just a technical note. The oldest Indus valley writings we have date to the middle of the first millennium BCE, so to say that the Indus valley "has a well known history" dating back to 3100 BC is somewhat misleading. We know a little about ancient Indus valley civilizations, but not enough to describe their history as well-known.

(October 27, 2018 at 8:50 pm)CDF47 Wrote: I believe Adam and Eve lived about 200,000 - 400,000 years ago in the Middle East.  I believe the generations highlighted in the Bible are just that "highlights."  I believe after the flood, the dates are more recent.

In other words you've made up your own religion. That puts you at the end of a LONG line of charlatans who pulled shit of of thin air to make themselves feel comfortable with what they think feels right. You have no justification for any of it.

(October 28, 2018 at 9:20 am)Jörmungandr Wrote: @Bucky:

Just a technical note.  The oldest Indus valley writings we have date to the middle of the first millennium BCE, so to say that the Indus valley "has a well known history" dating back to 3100 BC is somewhat misleading.  We know a little about ancient Indus valley civilizations, but not enough to describe their history as well-known.

Actually, we have samples of Indus Valley scripts from the the 4th millennium BCE.   Wikipedia offers the citations.  In fact the writing system appears to have gone extinct well before the beginning of the 1st millennium BCE.

The corpus of Harappan script remains largely Undeciphered, and in any case does not appear to contain chronicals or political dosuments, so the internal history of Indus Valley civilization prior to 1st millennium BCE is necessarily not as well known as those of some others as others.  But we do have an outline of the culture, the scope, the economy, and the influence of Harappan civilization to discern its age and its role as one of the main center of Bronze Age civilization and exerted substantial cultural influence on later civilizations on Indian subcontinent.

(June 26, 2018 at 8:34 pm)CDF47 Wrote: This was a scientific thread with religious implications.  Then I was asked religious questions which is understandable.

(October 28, 2018 at 2:39 am)CDF47 Wrote:

(October 28, 2018 at 2:11 am)Nay_Sayer Wrote: Techniques Shmecniques.  you really gonna believe some fancy-pants scientist with so-called book learnin and diplomas?!

Not always no.  Science is way too political for that.

good man, good man.

(October 28, 2018 at 9:31 am)Anomalocaris Wrote:

(October 28, 2018 at 9:20 am)Jörmungandr Wrote: @Bucky:

Just a technical note.  The oldest Indus valley writings we have date to the middle of the first millennium BCE, so to say that the Indus valley "has a well known history" dating back to 3100 BC is somewhat misleading.  We know a little about ancient Indus valley civilizations, but not enough to describe their history as well-known.

Actually, we have samples of Indus Valley scripts from the the 4th millennium BCE.   Wikipedia offers the citations.  In fact the writing system appears to have gone extinct well before the beginning of the 1st millennium BCE.

The corpus of Harappan script remains largely Undeciphered, and in any case does not appear to contain chronicals or political dosuments, so the internal history of Indus Valley civilization prior to 1st millennium BCE is necessarily not as well known as those of some others as others.  But we do have an outline of the culture, the scope, the economy, and the influence of Harappan civilization to discern its age and its role as one of the main center of Bronze Age civilization and exerted substantial cultural influence on later civilizations on Indian subcontinent.

Do we have any even partially complete texts from the Harappan civilization? Examples of script are not writings. I stand by what I said. Produce a text from that period and I'll concede the point. Moreover, if the samples we do have are undeciphered, in what way do they constitute 'history'?

The entire body of scripts we have found is generally conceded to be more than sufficient to show it have functioned as complete system of writing before 2000 BCE even if the system remains undeciphered.    There is no requirement for any individual text to be “complete” for the script on it to recognized as or even to be adaquate basis of decipherment of writing.  As it happens many samples of Harappan script from both before and during the mature period are complete in the sense that the document is whole and contains everything it was originally meant to contain.  Unfortunately most Harappan documents are brief.   But there are lengthy samples containing 20-30 characters.  

The fact that Harappan script remains undeciphered only hinder progress in understanding of some aspects of its history.   However the scribes of Harappan civilization appears not to have been as much employed in producing chronicals as those of some other cultures, so it is not certain that even the successful decipherment of the Harappan script would aid in producing detailed political or administrative history as might be hoped.

However, Much of such aspects of the evolution of any culture, such as scope, rise and fall of population centers, types of economy, organization of society, even forms of government and system of trade, all parts of a culture’s history, can be deduced from excavations and examinations of artifact.   We have quite extensive archeological records of Harappan culture encompassing remains of literally several thousand different towns, cities and settlements.   Artifacts such as statuettes from Harappan culture has been in public consciousness as the Mohenjo Daro civilization since before WWII.   we have reasonable broad outlines of scope and evolution of Harappan culture to decent idea where they existed, how they lived.   We certainly know of other Bronze Age cultures that existed contemporaneously with Harappan cultures but of which we know much less either in professional circles or amongst the general public.   So I don’t think it is at all unfair to say history of Harappan culture is well known, relatively, even if we might not perceive them to be as well known as those that have left us decipherable contemporaneous records, or those that exhibited clear continuity to some later point when historic restrospectives produced can be attempted to be believed.

Where to hell is that lion. He has got some answering to do. Why should he need Sundays off? Total bullshit, man.