(November 29, 2019 at 4:28 pm)Klorophyll Wrote:

(November 29, 2019 at 4:04 pm)The Valkyrie Wrote: It’s an Abrahamic religion (bad enough) spread by the sword.

I have no intention of embracing it.

And why is Abrahamic bad ?

And you consider it bad compared to what exactly ?

Because the Abrahamic religions are responsible for many evils in the world.

Compared to practically everything else.

I wouldn't 'embrace Islam' if it was choking on a grape and I was the only one in the room who knew the Heimlich Manoeuvre.

Boru

Boru

Once rational, logical reasoning is embraced, there is little room for fairy tales and daydreams.

(November 29, 2019 at 5:06 pm)Grandizer Wrote: I've been aware of these points you made by many other Muslims I've encountered in the past, including Muslim relatives. It's just as sketchy as almost any other religion. Arguing for a non-Trinitarian God, or telling me that you believe the texts have been well preserved, doesn't prove that Islam is true. It's just a couple of statements that Muslims hold to.

And I'm not interested in numerology or perverse reinterpretations of Qur'anic verse to reflect modern scientific findings. So hopefully you're not one of those apologists who harp on about any of that.

I don't claim Islam being better at certain aspects makes it true, I merely say that most atheists in the West left their faith for reasons that are specific to their former religion, and they should thus think hard about the remaining major religions. And no, numerology and reinterpretations are not interesting to me either since they tend to force the texts to say things that aren't there.

One historical proof of the truth of our religion is usually presented like this : Muhammad challenged his contemporaries - who were highly proficient in the arabic language in all its aspects - to come up with sayings just as eloquent as the Qur'an's. This kind of literary challenge was common at his time. Why is this valid evidence ? Because the challenge is appropriate to the cultural context in which Muhammad found himself in, and since his contemporaries objectively failed to address the challenge, and prefered to prosecute him and his followers rather than respond intellectually, this makes his claim more credible.

Jesus's contemporaries were well versed - relatively to their time - in medical science, so his "prophetic challenge" had something to do with resurrecting the dead, which the very impossible thing to cure.

I know this is extremely oversimplified, I'm just trying to clarify how the reasoning goes.

(November 29, 2019 at 5:09 pm)Apathyst Wrote: say some dude I don’t know from Adam tries to sell me some unicorn poop. I look at it and say looks like a rock. He responds but it’s the best most special and prettiest unicorn poop ever. I’ll still want proof unicorns actually exist before I consider buying some unicorn poop. He points to the poop and says there is the proof right there! How could there be unicorn poop if there are no unicorns? Now give me 11 drakspas and take the unicorn poop! See where I am going with this? I don’t need to touch the guys rock and feel it and study it cause no matter how intimately I get to know it I ain’t buying it till I see a flippin unicorn and no amount of rocks you show me insisting they are unicorn poop is going to change my mind. Want me to buy your unicorn poop? First you gotta show me a unicorn then we can discuss the merits of its poop...

I get what you're saying, just because Islam might be better doesn't prove it's true. I am arguing here that Islam deserves to be looked into much more than any other religion - Abrahamic or not - since its core beliefs are sensible.

---

(November 29, 2019 at 5:23 pm)brewer Wrote: Nope. You pay a bit more attention to what you worship.

I don't worship Muhammad. You pay a bit more attention to your religious education, if you took any.

(November 29, 2019 at 5:50 pm)Klorophyll Wrote:

---

(November 29, 2019 at 5:23 pm)brewer Wrote: Nope. You pay a bit more attention to what you worship.

I don't worship Muhammad. You pay a bit more attention to your religious education, if you took any.

Way to side step the pedophile babbler.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of..._tradition

(November 29, 2019 at 5:25 pm)The Valkyrie Wrote: Because the Abrahamic religions are responsible for many evils in the world.

Compared to practically everything else.

Anything can be responsible for evil. Science produced nuclear bombs, does at make scientific inquiry any less reliable ? Of course religions can be harmful if misunderstood.
Lots of beliefs are much more harmful (eugenics, white supremacy, etc.)

It doesn't matter whether one fictional story is more convincing than another fictional story when there is absolutely no evidence for either.
What believers don't realise is that all the evidence for disproving their fiction is right there in their mannerisms and behaviours.
They all have the same childish way of looking at life and schizophrenic way of attributing meaning to patterns.

(November 29, 2019 at 6:02 pm)Little lunch Wrote: It doesn't matter whether one fictional story is more convincing than another fictional story when there is absolutely no evidence for either.
What believers don't realise is that all the evidence for disproving their fiction is right there in their mannerisms and behaviours.
They all have the same childish way of looking at life and schizophrenic way of attributing meaning to patterns.

How do you know our story is fictional if you didn't look into it ? And can you disprove my fiction for me, please ?

Also, childish according to your standards doesn't mean false. Shouldn't the true religion be accessible to all with any level of education?

I am Iron Man!