(October 3, 2020 at 8:41 am)Eleven Wrote: He hated his human creations so much that he drowned them all, thinking only one family was worthy of a second go via incest.

He hated us so much, that he preferred joining forces with the devil to torture poor Job.

He hates us so much that he allows the devil to live when he has no problems allowing children to starve, be raped, and die of cancer.

That is not a loving god. That is a monster.

How funny is that, your saying that God should not be just or judge righteously. If God wasnt just or fair, and people didnt have to use faith then, people would walk all over Him. He himself knows that, that is why He put certain things in place. Hell, heaven, judgement for all who believer, those who dont believe, manifested evil, His promises, etc. This is all to show He cares and to see the need for him. You also have to see the reason why God does these things, look at context. 

Job for example was blessed twice as much in every area, in the end, God let Satan test God, for Job to be an example to us all. He let Satan test Job to solidify Satan disgust and hatred towards God and humans. He let Job to be tested for him to explain Himself in the bible. Etc. There are tons and tons of things i could say about Job and his story.

(November 25, 2020 at 3:09 pm)Prycejosh1987 Wrote: How funny is that, your saying that God should not be just or judge righteously. If God wasnt just or fair, and people didnt have to use faith then, people would walk all over Him. He himself knows that, that is why He put certain things in place. Hell, heaven, judgement for all who believer, those who dont believe, manifested evil, His promises, etc. This is all to show He cares and to see the need for him. You also have to see the reason why God does these things, look at context.

I am confused by the whole "faith" thing.  Why does a god require faith?  Why can't the actions and existence of a deity be clear?

Faith is required to believe in things that exist only in the imagination.  Faith is not required to believe in things that show evidence of existing in reality.

I realize that Christians grab a line from the bible that says that the natural world itself is proof of God's existence and nature.  But it isn't.  The natural world holds its own clues about how the universe works, that science can ascertain.

Faith is a bad substitute for reason.  Faith is a bad substitute for basic human kindness as well.

(October 3, 2020 at 8:56 am)Lawz Wrote: “The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.”

― Richard Dawkins, The God Delusion

Richard Dawkins was right!

Quote:How funny is that, your saying that God should not be just or judge righteously.

Accept he does neither. 

Quote: If God wasnt just or fair, and people didnt have to use faith then, people would walk all over Him. He himself knows that, that is why He put certain things in place.

Except he isn't fair and how does one walk all over an all-powerful being, And would any such being care about faith o begin with.

Quote: Hell, heaven, judgment for all who believe, those who don't believe, manifested evil, His promises, etc. 

And none of that is just or fair 

Quote:This is all to show He cares and to see the need for him.

No, it doesn't it shows the opposite and it makes him into nothing but a petty tyrannt 

Quote: You also have to see the reason why God does these things, look at context.

The context changes nothing

(October 3, 2020 at 8:41 am)Eleven Wrote: He hated his human creations so much that he drowned them all, thinking only one family was worthy of a second go via incest.

He hated us so much, that he preferred joining forces with the devil to torture poor Job.

He hates us so much that he allows the devil to live when he has no problems allowing children to starve, be raped, and die of cancer.

That is not a loving god. That is a monster.

It's interesting and humorous that you atheists think all the stories of the bible are made-up. Yet you are right there blasting them as actual events.

As for Theodicy? Evil exists. And God is the only way around it. Unfortunately, no one (especially here) invokes God for help. No, we (yes even me, 
sometimes) prefer to solve things ourselves....or blame someone else (aka God) for them, when we can't solve them. We forget that most all 
of our problems are caused by US!

Fortunately, there is a "Way"! Jesus. It's basically submitting to the, "Will of God". Accepting Him. Trusting Him. Loving Him...and each other. 

He paid the price for everything that YOU blamed Him for. And His "human creation" put Him to death for all those things and more!

Don't keep crucifying Him! Believe that the debt has been paid. He conquered evil for us, and death is now just a door. We can all choose to be divine 
children of God! Rather than perpetuating the lie that "everything is His fault"! 

Yes, we were given a Life. And we have free will. Let's use it for good, not evil. Love, not hate. And understand that many things we criticize God for is 
collectively in our power to remedy, or avoid. And what is not; is left to God's Will and Power to trust in.

John 3:16

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

Amen

1. Most of them are made up or at the very least heavily mythologized 

2.The mere existence of a problem implies a less optimal world. If God creates the world then no else can be blamed for its sub-optimal state. This of course assumes god is really something I don't accept, And of course, we are to blame for our problems and we have to solve them. We have no other option in a godless universe. 

3. We have no reason to do as you suggest and every reason to do the contrary 

4.A barbaric blood sacrifice pays for nothing let alone the collective suffering of all of humanity 

5.Freewill does not get your god off the hook. There is no contradiction between a world without evil or evil acts and one with free will. God if he existed didn't create such a world. So no he bears the blame.

So to sum up 

If God creates a bad world he is responsible for its badness 
If God does not solve the issue he is responsible for that decision 
A Blood Sacrifice is not a solution 
We have no reason to follow your advice 
Freewill and a world without evil are not contradictory 

Overall your Theodicy is bad 

(November 25, 2020 at 3:09 pm)Prycejosh1987 Wrote:

(October 3, 2020 at 8:41 am)Eleven Wrote: He hated his human creations so much that he drowned them all, thinking only one family was worthy of a second go via incest.

He hated us so much, that he preferred joining forces with the devil to torture poor Job.

He hates us so much that he allows the devil to live when he has no problems allowing children to starve, be raped, and die of cancer.

That is not a loving god. That is a monster.

How funny is that, your saying that God should not be just or judge righteously. If God wasnt just or fair, and people didnt have to use faith then, people would walk all over Him. He himself knows that, that is why He put certain things in place. Hell, heaven, judgement for all who believer, those who dont believe, manifested evil, His promises, etc. This is all to show He cares and to see the need for him. You also have to see the reason why God does these things, look at context. 

Job for example was blessed twice as much in every area, in the end, God let Satan test God, for Job to be an example to us all. He let Satan test Job to solidify Satan disgust and hatred towards God and humans. He let Job to be tested for him to explain Himself in the bible. Etc. There are tons and tons of things i could say about Job and his story.

Actually the Job story just shows the depths of god's evil. He forces the devil (yes forces, the devil didn't want to it) to murder a number of innocent people to see if Job would continue to worship him, the being who took away his life and his family on a whim.

If gods actions in this story are not evil then nothing is.

(November 30, 2020 at 2:35 am)SUNGULA Wrote: 1. Most of them are made up or at the very least heavily mythologized 

2.The mere existence of a problem implies a less optimal world. If God creates the world then no else can be blamed for its sub-optimal state. This of course assumes god is real something I don't accept, And of course, we are to blame for our problems and we have to solve them. We have no other option in a godless universe. 

3. We have no reason to do as you suggest and every reason to do the contrary 


4.A barbaric blood sacrifice pays for nothing let alone the collective suffering of all of humanity 


5.Freewill does not get your god off the hook. There is no contradiction between a world without evil or evil acts and one with freewill. God if he existed didn't create such a world. So no he bears the blame.

So to sum up 

If God creates a bad world he is responsible for its badness 
If God does not solve the issue he is responsible for that decision 
A Blood Sacrifice is not a solution 
We have no reason to follow your advice 
Freewill and a world without evil are not contradictory 

Overall your Theodicy is bad 

One uneducated opinion.

Next!

(November 30, 2020 at 2:37 am)ronedee Wrote:

(November 30, 2020 at 2:35 am)SUNGULA Wrote: 1. Most of them are made up or at the very least heavily mythologized 

2.The mere existence of a problem implies a less optimal world. If God creates the world then no else can be blamed for its sub-optimal state. This of course assumes god is real something I don't accept, And of course, we are to blame for our problems and we have to solve them. We have no other option in a godless universe. 

3. We have no reason to do as you suggest and every reason to do the contrary 


4.A barbaric blood sacrifice pays for nothing let alone the collective suffering of all of humanity 


5.Freewill does not get your god off the hook. There is no contradiction between a world without evil or evil acts and one with freewill. God if he existed didn't create such a world. So no he bears the blame.

So to sum up 

If God creates a bad world he is responsible for its badness 
If God does not solve the issue he is responsible for that decision 
A Blood Sacrifice is not a solution 
We have no reason to follow your advice 
Freewill and a world without evil are not contradictory 

Overall your Theodicy is bad 

One uneducated opinion.

Next!

So no counter then? Very telling 

(November 30, 2020 at 2:05 am)ronedee Wrote: It's interesting and humorous that you atheists think all the stories of the bible are made-up. Yet you are right there blasting them as actual events.

So, in order to criticise the evil depicted in the bible you believe that we have to believe that it's true. You're wrong we can criticise fairy stories all we want especially so when, like the bible, they are influential in the commission of real life evil acts.