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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:13 pm
(January 26, 2021 at 12:03 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: (January 26, 2021 at 11:51 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote:
What would be the issue with that, and wouldn't changing our moral proclamations to accord with more and/or better information over time be a good thing?
The issue I would have with that, is that our instincts are set for our best possible end by nature. To change them is to try to second guess nature.
We are natural animals. What change to our instincts would you suggest, given that they are set for our best end?
I appreciate your generalized thinking, but let's get specific.
Regards
DL
(January 26, 2021 at 11:57 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: @Greatest I am
Set and setting decide ALL moral values, both for individuals and whole societies. In various periods in China and Rome, for example, infanticide was often used without economic hardship being part of the equation (read Cicero’s letters). And yet today, no valid excuse exists for leaving your newborn at the local tip. Why? Because infanticide is no longer morally acceptable. Why? Because morals and moral values change.
Boru
?? Which moral value changed?
When did the morality that says we should not murder our children needlessly change in those you name happen?
Why did the practice die out if not a change in the set and setting?
The choice was having a productive member starve to death or the baby.
Which would you choose?
Regards
DL
It was once morally acceptable to kill a newborn out of convenience. It no longer is.
This isn’t hard.
Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:19 pm
(January 26, 2021 at 12:10 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: (January 26, 2021 at 12:03 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: The issue I would have with that, is that our instincts are set for our best possible end by nature. To change them is to try to second guess nature. IDK. It seems our instincts would be set at the biological level for whatever was best for our population, not the individual. Self destructive individuality is a successful survival strategy for populations. We know them as sentries, warriors, martyrs, or heroes.
Quote:We are natural animals. What change to our instincts would you suggest, given that they are set for our best end?
I appreciate your generalized thinking, but let's get specific.
Regards
DL
As before - suppose we were second guessing nature, and we do that alot with our moral intuition. Is that a problem, why?
It's natural to preach inequality for women and for gays, a not so small amount of bigotry appears to be instinctual. Do you take moral issue with that?
What makes you think it natural to devalue gays and women and think of them as second class?
Do you do so naturally?
Where do you see us second guessing nature?
I see us ignoring to help nature get to it's best end, but do not see us second guessing it.
Regards
DL
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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:22 pm
(This post was last modified: January 26, 2021 at 12:22 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
.....because it's a thing we see populations of human beings doing in nature. Do you take moral issue with them doing those things?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:24 pm
(This post was last modified: January 26, 2021 at 12:25 pm by Greatest I am.)
Boru
Where? When? How often?
How was it justified and give your source please.
Was that only in religions or are you talking a particular government?
Regards
DL
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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:25 pm
If it's not something that we see populations of human beings doing in nature...what could you possibly be objecting to?
This is absurd.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:28 pm
(January 26, 2021 at 12:22 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: .....because it's a thing we see populations of human beings doing in nature. Do you take moral issue with them doing those things? Doing what, exactly?
I said I did not see a double guessing of nature. With your generalizations, we again stall.
Regards
DL
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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:30 pm
(January 26, 2021 at 12:24 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: Boru
Where? When? How often?
How was it justified and give your source please.
Was that only in religions or are you talking a particular government?
Regards
DL
I’ve already given you one source. Reading Cicero and Aristotle will tell you that in Greek and Roman society as a whole, infanticide was both moral and legal.
You can use search engines as well as I can. Go nuts.
Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:31 pm
(January 26, 2021 at 12:25 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: If it's not something that we see populations of human beings doing in nature...what could you possibly be objecting to?
This is absurd.
I agree.
I have no objections.
I hardly know what the hell you are talking about and have only objected to your vagueness.
Regards
DL
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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:31 pm
Is preaching inequality and hate something that you see populations of humans doing, in nature, which you take moral issue with?
If not, if you can't even imagine what I'm talking about....what does the OPQ, specifically, refer to?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Are religions that preach inequality for women and gays, traitors to their country?
January 26, 2021 at 12:33 pm
(This post was last modified: January 26, 2021 at 1:21 pm by Greatest I am.)
(January 26, 2021 at 12:30 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: (January 26, 2021 at 12:24 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: Boru
Where? When? How often?
How was it justified and give your source please.
Was that only in religions or are you talking a particular government?
Regards
DL
I’ve already given you one source. Reading Cicero and Aristotle will tell you that in Greek and Roman society as a whole, infanticide was both moral and legal.
You can use search engines as well as I can. Go nuts.
Boru
A good way to end.
Me reading 40 books to find whatever you think you know.
Go away.
Regards
DL
(January 26, 2021 at 12:31 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Is preaching inequality and hate something that you see populations of humans doing, in nature, which you take moral issue with?
If not, if you can't even imagine what I'm talking about....what does the OPQ, specifically, refer to?
It is mostly the religions that preach homophobia and misogyny.
I know of no other ideology that does.
Regards
DL
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