(August 18, 2021 at 7:15 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:

(August 18, 2021 at 7:00 am)FlatAssembler Wrote: And that is the reason America is so successful. Greed is good.

This isn’t greed, exactly. It’s a stunningly cruel and heartless ‘me-ism’ that borders on psychopathy.

To be fair, though, America in other respects has been astoundingly generous throughout much of its history. Private citizens in the US donate more to charity than anyone else, and the US is always among the first to step up when disaster strikes.

Boru

No, it's greed. A destructive longing for gain and a destructive attempt at avioding loss or even inconvenience.

(August 17, 2021 at 9:44 pm)brewer Wrote:

(August 17, 2021 at 6:08 pm)Spongebob Wrote: I understand that it makes me a jerk but I don't care if he dies.

He's been vaccinated so it's not likely.

Maybe leg amputation?

No, they should amputate a body part he doesn't use, like his head.

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(August 18, 2021 at 6:04 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: What the world has learned is that Americans are - in this regard - astoundingly selfish. Not the ordinary, garden variety ‘I’ve got stuff I’m not going to share with you’ kind of selfish, but a bone chilling ‘I’d rather watch you die than put myself through a minor inconvenience’ kind of selfish.

Boru

So, I'm in my 50's and most of my life has been very well adjusted and stable.  I grew up with an image that the United States was an altogether great country and only getting better.  The last few years have been a total disaster in many ways and they have made it clear that despite the nice coat of red, white and blue patriotism, America is mostly made up of greedy, ignorant white people who hate just about everyone else and hate the very idea of diversity of race, thought or creed.  It has made me sick and I have become disgusted with it.  Just about every single moral concept I was taught as a Christian is complete bullshit.  Americans don't value anyone and don't value life at all.  Americans value money and their own personal power and absolutely nothing else.  Take away the nice infrastructure and cheap food supply and this country would descend into chaos overnight.  Some of this I already knew, but the depths of American depravity is so much worse than I ever thought possible.

(August 18, 2021 at 8:16 am)Spongebob Wrote: So, I'm in my 50's and most of my life has been very well adjusted and stable.  I grew up with an image that the United States was an altogether great country and only getting better.  The last few years have been a total disaster in many ways and they have made it clear that despite the nice coat of red, white and blue patriotism, America is mostly made up of greedy, ignorant white people who hate just about everyone else and hate the very idea of diversity of race, thought or creed.  It has made me sick and I have become disgusted with it.  Just about every single moral concept I was taught as a Christian is complete bullshit.  Americans don't value anyone and don't value life at all.  Americans value money and their own personal power and absolutely nothing else.  Take away the nice infrastructure and cheap food supply and this country would descend into chaos overnight.  Some of this I already knew, but the depths of American depravity is so much worse than I ever thought possible.

I think Americans have always been very self-absorbed, but the average American is very friendly, and believes they have as much charity and moral values as anyone else.

But I agree that something is happening in the political realm that is dangerous and self-destructive.

The current Western system of democracy, global trade, and global rules was largely put together by the U.S., as the sole superpower at the end of WWII.  Since then, democracy increased around the world, until now, when I believe it is in retreat - especially in the U.S.  On the rise are autocrats, oligarchs, single-party dictatorships, and strong-men who say "only I can fix it".

(August 18, 2021 at 10:27 am)HappySkeptic Wrote: I think Americans have always been very self-absorbed, but the average American is very friendly, and believes they have as much charity and moral values as anyone else.

But I agree that something is happening in the political realm that is dangerous and self-destructive.

The current Western system of democracy, global trade, and global rules was largely put together by the U.S., as the sole superpower at the end of WWII.  Since then, democracy increased around the world, until now, when I believe it is in retreat - especially in the U.S.  On the rise are autocrats, oligarchs, single-party dictatorships, and strong-men who say "only I can fix it".

I agree that Americans are generally friendly, but I've come to realize that this is nothing but window dressing.  I have lived in the south all my life and it's common curtesy in the south to greet people with friendly small talk, regardless of what you really think about them.  This has often elated people from other regions and they just love how friendly the south is.  I have to bring them down to earth and explain that no, those people don't actually like you; that's mostly pretend.  Southerners have been covering up their prejudices for a long time now because those prejudices have become socially unacceptable.  Trump, for whatever reason, stripped away that sheen of civility and now we see what Americans are truly made of.  I mean, it's possible to congratulate him for at least revealing the lie that America is a welcoming place for everyone.  It took a New Yorker to do that.

I am also concerned about the obvious retreat in liberal democracy across the globe.  Great Britain, Hungary, Poland, France, the US...populism is rising almost everywhere and it is usually accompanied by in-group complaints about diversity.  I fear the age of liberal democracy may soon be over and as you said, dictators will likely be the replacement.

(August 18, 2021 at 11:07 am)Spongebob Wrote: I have lived in the south all my life and it's common curtesy in the south to greet people with friendly small talk, regardless of what you really think about them.  This has often elated people from other regions and they just love how friendly the south is.  I have to bring them down to earth and explain that no, those people don't actually like you; that's mostly pretend.

Yup. I've seen this in action.

I mean, there are nice Southerners. But I know exactly what you're talking about. That "big ol' smile"... flattery... the whole shebang.

(August 18, 2021 at 11:23 am)vulcanlogician Wrote:

(August 18, 2021 at 11:07 am)Spongebob Wrote: I have lived in the south all my life and it's common curtesy in the south to greet people with friendly small talk, regardless of what you really think about them.  This has often elated people from other regions and they just love how friendly the south is.  I have to bring them down to earth and explain that no, those people don't actually like you; that's mostly pretend.

Yup. I've seen this in action.

I mean, there are nice Southerners. But I know exactly what you're talking about. That "big ol' smile"... flattery... the whole shebang.

You guys mean the "Bless your heart" thing?

No one can cut deeper than a Southern woman when she really gets her "polite" on.

(August 18, 2021 at 11:25 am)arewethereyet Wrote: You guys mean the "Bless your heart" thing?

No one can cut deeper than a Southern woman when she really gets her "polite" on.

Being insulted in New York: "Fuck you, you fucking piece of fucking shit!"  screams a man wearing 10 pounds of gold jewelry.

Being insulted in the south: "He can't help how he is, that's how god made him."  said by a grandmother with a big grin.

(August 18, 2021 at 7:15 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:

(August 18, 2021 at 7:00 am)FlatAssembler Wrote: And that is the reason America is so successful. Greed is good.

This isn’t greed, exactly. It’s a stunningly cruel and heartless ‘me-ism’ that borders on psychopathy.

To be fair, though, America in other respects has been astoundingly generous throughout much of its history. Private citizens in the US donate more to charity than anyone else, and the US is always among the first to step up when disaster strikes.

Boru

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: you ever hear of the Marshmallow Experiment? The one where a small child has to choose between one marshmallow now and two fifteen minutes from now?



It’s like in order to be a Republican politician now, you have to be the sort of person who heard the instructions and immediately gobbled up the one marshmallow now. And if you’re asking whether I mean as a preschooler or as an adult, the answer is yes.

I would say any true Republican gobbled up his marshmallow, then grabbed the bag and ran out the door with it, screaming "sucker"!

Just got word that the stepfather of one of my wife's friends is expected to die of covid. Anti-vax and anti-mask, of course.

I feel bad for his children and grandkids, but this guy made his own bed.