(July 5, 2022 at 2:42 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: More importantly, our new friend can and has said whatever crossed his mind, and is in no way shape or form being censored by the 30/30 rule whether it was permanent or temporary.  As we might all remember, people found ways to speak their mind..with words..before links were a thing.  

Steady progress on my wingnut bingo card though.  

Did you have anything to add to the topic at hand?  Or were you going to answer my question of what unit you were in?

(July 5, 2022 at 3:07 pm)weaponoffreedom Wrote:

(July 5, 2022 at 2:42 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: More importantly, our new friend can and has said whatever crossed his mind, and is in no way shape or form being censored by the 30/30 rule whether it was permanent or temporary.  As we might all remember, people found ways to speak their mind..with words..before links were a thing.  

Steady progress on my wingnut bingo card though.  

Did you have anything to add to the topic at hand?  Or were you going to answer my question of what unit you were in?

He did answer you.

Surprisingly on the thread where you asked the question.

Try to keep up.

(July 5, 2022 at 3:09 pm)arewethereyet Wrote:

(July 5, 2022 at 3:07 pm)weaponoffreedom Wrote: Did you have anything to add to the topic at hand?  Or were you going to answer my question of what unit you were in?

He did answer you.

Surprisingly on the thread where you asked the question.

Try to keep up.

sorry, i am stupid, another administrator?

The point of this question originally, before all the BS, was to ask how the preceding question was possible............The reason I joined this forum was to see how people thought about GOD, in contrast to religion and science.........I saw a post about science upstaging GOD..........so I started this post.

To be fair, I will say I HATE religion and what is really stands for, and I used to be an atheist.  I saw no other way or evidence.  Until I started to ask the right questions, and wanted to share at least one of these questions I asked with the readers of this forum.

Beyond all the mystery about the beginnings of everything, it seems to be a question that is asked in discussion........"Well how did it all begin?"  And "how can you prove it".  The truth is, that no one can ever know exactly what the deal is, but there is a lot of evidence as to what happened after the big bang.  Beating a dead horse there.  One of these pieces of evidence, is the measureable distance of the known universe.  I am not a scientist, and it is likely beyond most full comprehension, but lets say that the science is right, or at least close and the scientist know what they are talking about. (which in many cases they do)  This pertains specifically to after the big bang..............

In order for light to exist, there must be a cause...........you know, cause and effect.  So it stands to reason, that the universe, would in fact be larger than the distance that light would have travelled in the same time, because it came into existence after, long after.  You cant get something from nothing right? as in the first law of thermodynamics: also known as the law of conservation of energy, states that energy can neither be created nor destroyed, but it can be changed from one form to another.

So, with that in mind, "stuff came first" (cause) then light (effect).  Interesting concept, that is backed up by all the laws of physics, especially thermodynamics.

I have been very analytical.......wanting proof of everything.................and if you would speak to anyone looking for facts in a case, say a murder case, or fraud case, or really any investigation, they will tell you that the two most important aspects of finding out the truth in a story, is finding out two things about the author............

What did they know and when did they know it?

Genesis 1-4

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness.


How did these hut dwelling individuals know that "stuff" came first, and light came after?  When did they know it?  Well the book is older than all of us, especially modern science, so I will let you decide that.

Was it just a good guess?

It was then that I found out many other truths in science that PROVE the existence of GOD.  And now I understand it to be no other way.

For what its worth, there was a big bang.

Well, the question of how was answered quick and early, and.... apparently..you were already aware of that explanation.

We get nuts who swear to allah that the quran is a magic book too, full of scientific miracles.

(July 5, 2022 at 4:09 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Well, the question of how was answered quick and early, and.... apparently..you were already aware of that explanation.  

We get nuts who swear to allah that the quran is a magic book too, full of scientific miracles.

Well, I was aware of the explanation when I came up with it.  The question was not for me, but the readers.  Really has nothing to do with the book, although it is referenced, really has to do with the mentioned "what did THEY know and when did THEY know it"......but I guess you missed that.

Figured I would go ahead and answer the question, before the thread got hijacked by more BS.

(July 5, 2022 at 3:58 pm)weaponoffreedom Wrote: So, with that in mind, "stuff came first" (cause) then light (effect).  Interesting concept, that is backed up by all the laws of physics, especially thermodynamics.

I have been very analytical.......wanting proof of everything.................and if you would speak to anyone looking for facts in a case, say a murder case, or fraud case, or really any investigation, they will tell you that the two most important aspects of finding out the truth in a story, is finding out two things about the author............

What did they know and when did they know it?

Genesis 1-4

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness.


How did these hut dwelling individuals know that "stuff" came first, and light came after?  When did they know it?  Well the book is older than all of us, especially modern science, so I will let you decide that.

Was it just a good guess?

It was then that I found out many other truths in science that PROVE the existence of GOD.  And now I understand it to be no other way.

For what its worth, there was a big bang.

I don't think you understand the ideas you are talking about.  The laws of thermodynamics come about because of the the statistical flow of disorder (entropy) in an ensemble of particles.   It is only tangentially connected to light (Blackbody radiation).

Light itself came about at around the same time as the current laws of physics and the creation of charged particles, as light is just the electromagnetic force carrier.  However, the universe wasn't transparent until the density reduced.

As for the passage in Genesis, it is clearly talking about an Earth and a Heavens (ground and sky) but without life or light.  Then the stars and the Sun light up (as light didn't exist yet).  Is that part of the Big Bang?  No - it is the imagination of someone who has no concept of modern astrophysics.  It is also wrong. 

Stars existed for billions of years before the solar system, so light existed before the Earth, and the Sun turned on before the Earth formed.  So, scientifically it is all wrong.

They didn't know shit, and just like the islamic nuts... as evidenced by the text in magic book above...neither do you.

First light is 240-300k after the big bang. Notably absent in the universe, any earth to have any waters to "hover over". Maybe it was a transposition error. God told Some Guy the actual order, but he fucked it up and switched them around? Or, hey, maybe this god just doesn't know what the actual order was and Some Guy credulously but very accurately recorded it's order of events. This issue reoccurs throughout genesis. Either way, those are two possibilities, assuming a god, that magic book ended up in the state it is today.

Frankly, I'm not sure how we go from "some guys knew some shit" to "therefore god exists" - but I wouldn't want to risk the second bit by granting the first right or wrong-making ability...particularly if magic book was going to be my case example. We either do or don't believe that the scientific accuracy of a magic book is indicative of whether the god of that magic book exists - but, if so, then the scientific inaccuracy of a magic book would suggest what about the god of that magic book?

If a god made the universe (that is, everything that exists) then where was he before he made it?

(July 5, 2022 at 4:25 pm)HappySkeptic Wrote:

(July 5, 2022 at 3:58 pm)weaponoffreedom Wrote: So, with that in mind, "stuff came first" (cause) then light (effect).  Interesting concept, that is backed up by all the laws of physics, especially thermodynamics.

I have been very analytical.......wanting proof of everything.................and if you would speak to anyone looking for facts in a case, say a murder case, or fraud case, or really any investigation, they will tell you that the two most important aspects of finding out the truth in a story, is finding out two things about the author............

What did they know and when did they know it?

Genesis 1-4

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness.


How did these hut dwelling individuals know that "stuff" came first, and light came after?  When did they know it?  Well the book is older than all of us, especially modern science, so I will let you decide that.

Was it just a good guess?

It was then that I found out many other truths in science that PROVE the existence of GOD.  And now I understand it to be no other way.

For what its worth, there was a big bang.

I don't think you understand the ideas you are talking about.  The laws of thermodynamics come about because of the the statistical flow of disorder (entropy) in an ensemble of particles.   It is only tangentially connected to light (Blackbody radiation).

Light itself came about at around the same time as the current laws of physics and the creation of charged particles, as light is just the electromagnetic force carrier.  However, the universe wasn't transparent until the density reduced.

As for the passage in Genesis, it is clearly talking about an Earth and a Heavens (ground and sky) but without life or light.  Then the stars and the Sun light up (as light didn't exist yet).  Is that part of the Big Bang?  No - it is the imagination of someone who has no concept of modern astrophysics.  It is also wrong. 

Stars existed for billions of years before the solar system, so light existed before the Earth, and the Sun turned on before the Earth formed.  So, scientifically it is all wrong.

Thanks for your semi respectful reply............entropy is the second law, in that it is continually expanding, just like the universe.  Review the first.

The heavens and earth is not our planet and heaven.......it refers to everything you can touch, and everything you can't.  Research this.