Quote:If you simply lack any belief about God or gods you are simply acknowledging your own ignorance, again.

What is truly appalling is that this person is so very blind to his own copious ignorance. It is clear that we waste our breath. Reason and rationality are consensual and he doesn't operate that way. He just dresses his prejudice and bias up in logical sounding statements which don't hold water. Once you point that out and he doesn't cop to any of it anything more said is surely a wasted effort.

(December 18, 2011 at 6:09 pm)Ace Otana Wrote: Well I am ignorant of a lot of things, so are you. What makes me smarter is that I can admit it. I don't KNOW if there is such a thing as a god. However I've seen no evidence, no reason to believe such a thing exists. Just as I don't believe in fairies, why would I? Fairies could possibly exist, they may in fact do but so far I've seen no reason or evidence to suggest that they exist.

Quote:That is not atheism.

That is atheism. Just not 'your' version of atheism.

This person probably thinks the mischief he does here doesn't reflect on his true self or on Christians generally but I know from the atmosphere I experience on these forums how untrue that is. Christians are held in more contempt here than they all deserve because of the actions of punks like this. I believe that his behavior here is absolutely a reflection of his true character. Since I think hell is a metaphor for what we experience here and now given our life choices I cannot believe he is a happy person.

(December 18, 2011 at 3:45 pm)amkerman Wrote: your response is very telling of your lack of insight on the subject Chuck. Surely you have given a great deal of thought on the subject; unfortunately, you just aren't very smart. Ad Hominem attacks only offer any truth about the speaker.

"An idiot so idiotic that he thinks he can get somewhere pretending to be intelligent in front of those wiser than he" is the real heart of the problem with you, dancing around it is a waste of time.

(December 18, 2011 at 6:41 pm)Chuck Wrote:

(December 18, 2011 at 3:45 pm)amkerman Wrote: your response is very telling of your lack of insight on the subject Chuck. Surely you have given a great deal of thought on the subject; unfortunately, you just aren't very smart. Ad Hominem attacks only offer any truth about the speaker.

An idiot so idiotic that he thinks he can get somewhere pretending to be intelligent.

Agreed but now I'm bored with him.

I am not trying to convince anyone. The argument is there. You can accept or reject it. It seems many have rejected it outright, and began to attack me. I havent seen a response (actually there was one person who actually responded a few pages back, which I appreciated) to my argument yet. You call me an apologetic, mince my words, attempt to catch me in some sort of "gotcha" moment, but all off that is irrelevant to the point I have made, which I will state again:

A belief in objective morality, that things have value, in the most simplistic sense that any belief held by anyone ever was inherently true, apart from the fact that it was a belief (gravity, electro magnetism, thermo-dynamics) asactual laws of the universe necessarily stems from a belief that consciousness is a primary function of the universe (like physics), think a unifying theory, That belief would correctly be described as a belief in a monotheistic diety. Atheism then necessarily denotes a belief that inherent truth and reality do not actually exist, and that all views and beliefs are purely subjective. atheism can not reconcile a belief in objective truth or reality with a belief that "God" (consciousness as a primary function of the universe) does not exist.

(December 18, 2011 at 6:41 pm)Chuck Wrote: "An idiot so idiotic that he thinks he can get somewhere pretending to be intelligent in front of those wiser than he" is the real heart of the problem with you, dancing around it is a waste of time.

One thing I've noticed with many of them is how they try to act all intelligent by using clever words in some poor attempt to create mist to hide the true side of themselves.

whateverist... If "God" does not exist there can be no such thing as a bad person or a good person. In a purely mechanical universe there is no meaning to anything besides that which individuals arbitrarily assign them, there is no "truth" to anything you say about me or in general. You are simply a cluster of organic matter that by cosmic chance attained consciousness. That consciousness is not real, however, beyond your own perception.

Would you like to close the book on the nature of good and evil, once and for all? Show that there is such a thing as objective morality? Perhaps definitely show us how we can avoid solipsism? Thought not. You started a thread, you claimed to have an argument against atheism, I still want to hear it.

Rhythm: atheism is illogical; i have stated why many times. It goes against all scientific knowledge and achievement.

(December 18, 2011 at 6:55 pm)amkerman Wrote: whateverist... If "God" does not exist there can be no such thing as a bad person or a good person. In a purely mechanical universe there is no meaning to anything besides that which individuals arbitrarily assign them, there is no "truth" to anything you say about me or in general. You are simply a cluster of organic matter that by cosmic chance attained consciousness. That consciousness is not real, however, beyond your own perception.

You have such a bleak view on things. At least I can see the wonders and beauty of nature. I guess it's just beyond your comprehension.

It's not all pointle....oh forget it. Go back to your church godboy. That's where you belong.

I can't prove that objective morality or truth exists, so I can not claim that an atheistic worldview is wrong. Indeed, if "God" does not exist, then atheism is neither right nor wrong, neither good nor bad. Nether are any religions. They simply are if consciousness is not a primary function of the universe. I believe that an atheistic world view is probably incorrect, because everything I have seen and my experiences lead me to believe that things like bad and good do exist. People have feelings, laws of nature and science have order, people for the most part universally agree that certain things are bad or good.