(October 28, 2023 at 1:52 am)Barry Wrote: I didn’t say atheists are “irresponsible”, I said they don’t want the burden of being “responsible”. Being a believer in God actually means one knows one is “responsible” for one’s actions and decisions. I don’t believe in “once saved always saved.

Said every priest pedophile and priests leaders that hide them.

Being a believer in godiboi means one is an absolute fucking moron.

(October 28, 2023 at 3:24 am)Barry Wrote:

(October 28, 2023 at 2:05 am)Ahriman Wrote: You are either responsible for your actions and decisions, or God is doing stuff for you. Can't be both.

Yes, you are responsible for it all. We agree. Atheists are like Moses, they are “in deNile”.

Why the fuck should I be responsible if I had no fucken choice to be here?

(October 28, 2023 at 2:09 pm)h4ym4n Wrote:

(October 28, 2023 at 3:24 am)Barry Wrote: Yes, you are responsible for it all. We agree. Atheists are like Moses, they are “in deNile”.

Why the fuck should I be responsible if I had no fucken choice to be here?

That's a good point. I guess somebody has to take responsibility at some point, but is it going to be me? Lol, no. I've got better things to do.

(October 28, 2023 at 3:24 am)Barry Wrote:

(October 28, 2023 at 2:05 am)Ahriman Wrote: You are either responsible for your actions and decisions, or God is doing stuff for you. Can't be both.

Yes, you are responsible for it all. We agree. Atheists are like Moses, they are “in deNile”.

We also deny tooth fairies and sasquatches and sea monsters, for the same reason.

(October 28, 2023 at 3:52 am)Ahriman Wrote:

(October 28, 2023 at 3:24 am)Barry Wrote: Yes, you are responsible for it all. We agree. Atheists are like Moses, they are “in deNile”.

If I'm responsible for everything I do, then why do I need God? If God doesn't interfere in my decision-making at all, meaning God does nothing for me, why would I pay any attention to God?

Good question Ahriman. God created humankind for a reason. God didn’t just create us as a huge experiment and then ignore us. Humankind started sinning, thinking they didn’t need God. They thought they knew better. Sinning is doing what we, in our hearts, know is against God”s will. God became man, in Jesus Christ, and came to us to teach us how to live. Jesus gave us the “Greatest Commandment” i.e. “Love God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength”. He added “and love your neighbour as yourself”. 
God also gave us free will. So, yes, God doesn’t interfere with your decision-making”. But God gave you life and made you in “his own image and likeness”. A spiritual being with a human soul. 
You don’t have to pay any attention to God. Christians believe our souls are eternal and that we go to heaven or hell. Hell is a choice. It’s for people who choose to ignore God in their life. As a Roman Catholic I do not believe one has to be a Christian to go to heaven, but we have to do God’s will. It is written in our hearts.
God gave us the Ten Commandments, the Bible, and the Catholic Church, to help us turn back to him. 
90% of baptised Catholics do not attend weekly Mass in Europe and Australia. 80% in USA. They are not really Catholics. The Catholic Church has had a lot of problems, child abuse and the cover up being a terrible example. But it is, nevertheless, the “one, true Church”.
The only way we can live a truly happy life is by loving God and doing his will. That is why we should “pay attention to God”. Money, power, sex, material things never make anyone truly happy. Our secular society is a miserable society.
I am waging my own campaign in the Catholic Church to try to make it an evangelising Church, but my humble efforts fall on deaf ears. Nevertheless it is a gift from God to help us  reach true happiness both on earth and eternally. 
God is a mystery, but God exists.

(October 28, 2023 at 4:52 pm)Barry Wrote: Good question Ahriman. God created humankind for a reason. God didn’t just create us as a huge experiment and then ignore us.

What reason do you think that is?

Quote:The only way we can live a truly happy life is by loving God and doing his will.  

This is a pretty strong claim that's unlikely to match the lived experience of..well..anyone here - yourself included.  

Quote:Money, power, sex, material things never make anyone truly happy. Our secular society is a miserable society.

Maybe speak for yourself.  There is a long list of things that don't make you happy.  You're miserable.

Here's what I wonder. Why do you need to believe this stuff? It's comically false on it's face - but you're insistent. Do you actually think there's no one out there that really is happy without your god? That this is just impossible? Would it diminish your own beliefs or self appraisal to accept that there are - and more of them than there are christians, no less?

@Barry

I find it absolutely hysterical that you don’t see the flaw here:

Quote: The Catholic Church has had a lot of problems, child abuse and the cover up being a terrible example. But it is, nevertheless, the “one, true Church”.

I always appreciate a good giggle. Ta.

Boru

(October 28, 2023 at 5:04 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote:

(October 28, 2023 at 4:52 pm)Barry Wrote: Good question Ahriman. God created humankind for a reason. God didn’t just create us as a huge experiment and then ignore us.

What reason do you think that is?
it wouldn’t make sense otherwise. 

Quote:The only way we can live a truly happy life is by loving God and doing his will.  

This is a pretty strong claim that's unlikely to match the lived experience of..well..anyone here.  
if you mean on this forum I accept that. Life is a struggle for everyone, but without a belief in God, it’s meaningless.

Quote:Money, power, sex, material things never make anyone truly happy. Our secular society is a miserable society.

Maybe speak for yourself.  There is a long list of things that don't make you happy.  You're miserable.

Here's what I wonder.  Why do you need to believe this stuff?  It's comically false on it's face - but you're insistent.  Do you really think there's no one out there that really is happy without your god?  That this is just impossible?  Would it diminish your own beliefs or self appraisal if there were?

Do you know anyone who is happy? There are some Christians whom we might describe as “happy clappers” who get caught up in the induced emotions of their services. But deep happiness can only be achieved by having a deep relationship with God. Yes, you may be happy while not consciously believing in God, and not believing in a church,  but if you live a good life, and follow the true heart knowledge received from God, you can be happier than any Christians who sin. But you cannot pretend. The story of Adam and Eve is a warning. And Sodom and Gomorrah. And the Tower of Babel.  Sin is sin, and never makes anyone happy. We all struggle with it. Happiness is avoiding it. We live a tiny time, compared with the life of our souls. God bless.

(October 28, 2023 at 4:52 pm)Barry Wrote:

(October 28, 2023 at 3:52 am)Ahriman Wrote: If I'm responsible for everything I do, then why do I need God? If God doesn't interfere in my decision-making at all, meaning God does nothing for me, why would I pay any attention to God?

Good question Ahriman. God created humankind for a reason. God didn’t just create us as a huge experiment and then ignore us. Humankind started sinning, thinking they didn’t need God. They thought they knew better. Sinning is doing what we, in our hearts, know is against God”s will. God became man, in Jesus Christ, and came to us to teach us how to live. Jesus gave us the “Greatest Commandment” i.e. “Love God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength”. He added “and love your neighbour as yourself”. 
God also gave us free will. So, yes, God doesn’t interfere with your decision-making”. But God gave you life and made you in “his own image and likeness”. A spiritual being with a human soul. 
You don’t have to pay any attention to God. Christians believe our souls are eternal and that we go to heaven or hell. Hell is a choice. It’s for people who choose to ignore God in their life. As a Roman Catholic I do not believe one has to be a Christian to go to heaven, but we have to do God’s will. It is written in our hearts.
God gave us the Ten Commandments, the Bible, and the Catholic Church, to help us turn back to him. 
90% of baptised Catholics do not attend weekly Mass in Europe and Australia. 80% in USA. They are not really Catholics. The Catholic Church has had a lot of problems, child abuse and the cover up being a terrible example. But it is, nevertheless, the “one, true Church”.
The only way we can live a truly happy life is by loving God and doing his will. That is why we should “pay attention to God”. Money, power, sex, material things never make anyone truly happy. Our secular society is a miserable society.
I am waging my own campaign in the Catholic Church to try to make it an evangelising Church, but my humble efforts fall on deaf ears. Nevertheless it is a gift from God to help us  reach true happiness both on earth and eternally. 
God is a mystery, but God exists.