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Catholic Church against Cesarean section
#1
Catholic Church against Cesarean section
I didn't know that Catholic Church is fervently against the Cesarean section.

I mean, WTF? I guess if there is anything that can ease a woman's life they are automatically against it. They see it against the moral laws (whatever that is), and that it encourages women to take contraceptives.

Instead, they forced women in Catholic hospitals to have symphysiotomy - a procedure involving slicing through the cartilage and ligaments of a pelvic joint (or in extreme cases, called pubiotomy, sawing through the bone of the pelvis itself) to widen it and allow a baby to be delivered unobstructed. Procedure left women with permanent back problems and habitual incontinence.

Here's some text about it (article is from 2014)

Quote:Petrified and in agony, Mary had been subjected to a symphysiotomy – a controversial operation that was seldom used in the rest of Europe after the mid-20th century, but which was carried out on an estimated 1,500 women in Ireland between the 1940s and 1980s.

Critics blame the continued use of the operation on a toxic mix of medical experimentation, Catholic aversion to caesarean sections and an institutional disregard for women’s autonomy. They claim it has left hundreds of surviving women with life-long pain, disability and emotional trauma. For some in Ireland, it is yet another scandal perpetrated against women and girls.

And last week saw the deadline pass for applications to the state’s ex gratia redress scheme, which offered women who have been through the procedure compensation sums of between £40,000 and £120,000. More than 300 women are said to have applied.

Mark Kelly of the Irish Council for Civil Liberties says that, despite having interviewed victims of torture, “this remains just one of the most appalling things that we have come across”. Nigel Rodley, chair of the UN Human Rights Committee, called the use of the operation without patients’ informed consent a “systematic assault”.

Mary says the long-term effects of the operation on her own health have been catastrophic. “I hold down a job, but only because of the painkillers,” she says. “I have arthritis in my hip and in the bottom of my spine. I walk with a limp. No one can help – there’s no way back. Getting up and down stairs or getting up on a chair I can’t really do. You get one leg up, then the other slips down.”

In Our Lady of Lourdes hospital in Drogheda in the north-east of Ireland, symphysiotomy survived well into the 1980s.

Perhaps the most shocking aspect of the women’s stories is the lack of consent. “These operations were covert, and the women were generally not informed it was going to happen,” stresses O’Connor. “The vast majority left hospital without knowing their pelvises had been broken. Many did not find out for decades. This was a mass medical experiment, and the doctors didn’t really study the long-term side-effects. In many cases it destroyed lives.”

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle...caesareans


Another article from 2003.

Quote:Insisting that symphysiotomy, the widening of the woman's pelvis in difficult child-births, was a natural procedure in accordance with the moral law and the teachings of the Catholic Church, Dr Barry called for its use rather than "unwarranted and unnecessary" resort to Caesarean section. He even argued that "all the bogies and pitfalls" mentioned in the textbooks against symphysiotomy were "sheer flights of imagination on the part of inexperienced writers".

Contrary to Dr Barry's contention, symphysiotomy proved to be a harmful procedure that was abandoned in the mid-1960s. 

Central to the renewed debate is the claim that the Catholic Church accepted Dr Barry's argument that symphysiotomy was a safer and more wholesome alternative to repeated Caesarean sections, which he warned could encourage women to use contraceptives.

Half a century later Barry's Blackrock address reads more like a preacher's tirade against sexual sin than a learned scientific piece of research. "It is unnecessary to stress to Catholic doctors that the practices of contraception, sterilisation and therapeutic abortion are contrary to the moral law," he thundered. "But what we must all guard against and especially is this so in the teaching centres, is the unwarranted and unnecessary employment of Caesarean section."

Dr Barry told the congress that every Catholic obstetrician should realise that the Caesarean operation was probably the chief cause for the practice by the profession of "the unethical procedure of sterilisation". Furthermore, it was very frequently responsible for encouraging the laity "in the improper prevention of pregnancy or in seeking termination".

There can be no doubt that Dr Barry would have been unable to advocate its adoption as the orthodox practice among Catholic doctors if he had not had Cardinal McQuaid's approval.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/catho...n-1.377151
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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#2
RE: Catholic Church against Cesarean section
Anything related to sex and they are against it (exceptions apply for priests and young boys though)
The meek shall inherit the Earth, the rest of us will fly to the stars.

Never underestimate the power of very stupid people in large groups

Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling with a pig in mud ..... after a while you realise that the pig likes it!

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#3
RE: Catholic Church against Cesarean section
(August 12, 2021 at 12:28 pm)zebo-the-fat Wrote: Anything related to sex and they are against it (exceptions apply for priests and young boys though)

I dated a catholic woman once.


She refused to have sex doggy style or her on top- as she was convinced that these were "homosexual positions"....

I shit you not.


......

Upside - absolute STELLAR oral.......


That birth control phobia does have an upside...


Big Grin
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#4
RE: Catholic Church against Cesarean section
I must have been raised a different kind of Catholic.
 “I believe in annoyed at first sight.” – Steve Maraboli                                              
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#5
RE: Catholic Church against Cesarean section
(August 12, 2021 at 12:39 pm)arewethereyet Wrote: I must have been raised a different kind of Catholic.

Do they have special classes on that sort of thing?

Huh
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#6
RE: Catholic Church against Cesarean section
(August 12, 2021 at 12:41 pm)onlinebiker Wrote:
(August 12, 2021 at 12:39 pm)arewethereyet Wrote: I must have been raised a different kind of Catholic.

Do they have special classes on that sort of thing?

Huh

I grew up in a town that was over 90% Catholic. I went to Catholic school from 6th grade through high school. We had a Basilica in town. I learn more about Catholic teachings here than I ever did there.
 “I believe in annoyed at first sight.” – Steve Maraboli                                              
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#7
RE: Catholic Church against Cesarean section
Crap city! I didn't know any of this either. I absolutely don't understand why anyone would submit to such medieval beliefs. OTOH, I know lots of Catholics and most of them practice birth control and some have had C-sections, so it's obvious that their flock doesn't take this nonsense seriously.

And btw, what twisted "logic" do they use to conclude that a c-section promotes the use of contraceptives? If anything would it's the procedure you just described.
Why is it so?
~Julius Sumner Miller
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#8
RE: Catholic Church against Cesarean section
The only thing I can sort of piece together is that it's often advised a woman have no more than three C-sections. I suppose that may promote the use of something other than the rhythm method of birth control, which is a no-no technically for Catholics. Beyond that, I got nuthin'.
 “I believe in annoyed at first sight.” – Steve Maraboli                                              
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#9
RE: Catholic Church against Cesarean section
(August 12, 2021 at 12:33 pm)onlinebiker Wrote:
(August 12, 2021 at 12:28 pm)zebo-the-fat Wrote: Anything related to sex and they are against it (exceptions apply for priests and young boys though)

I dated a catholic woman once.


She refused to have sex doggy style or her on top- as she was convinced that these were "homosexual positions"....

I shit you not.


......

Upside - absolute STELLAR oral.......


That birth control phobia does have an upside...


Big Grin

(August 12, 2021 at 12:43 pm)arewethereyet Wrote:
(August 12, 2021 at 12:41 pm)onlinebiker Wrote: Do they have special classes on that sort of thing?

Huh

I grew up in a town that was over 90% Catholic.  I went to Catholic school from 6th grade through high school.  We had a Basilica in town.  I learn more about Catholic teachings here than I ever did there.

The town I went to school in was about 15-20% Catholic.....

Most of what I learned was from Catholic women I dated.. There were a few and they varied a lot.

The craziest was a gorgeous petite latino - who after going out a few times and sleeping together a couple times asked me to go with her to mass at her church.

She FREAKED when I told her I was an athiest.


She might have reacted more hysterically if I sprouted horns, wings and told her I was the Antichrist - but not by much.

Oh well - fun while it lasted....
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#10
RE: Catholic Church against Cesarean section
(August 12, 2021 at 12:47 pm)arewethereyet Wrote: The only thing I can sort of piece together is that it's often advised a woman have no more than three C-sections.  I suppose that may promote the use of something other than the rhythm method of birth control, which is a no-no technically for Catholics.  Beyond that, I got nuthin'.

My understanding is that the only acceptable method of birth control is abstinence.  Even masturbation is a no-no because the equipment is there for one thing and one thing only, babies.  Why it feels so damn good is probably because god wants to tempt us with pleasure.  Hell, Catholic men are probably not supposed to enjoy the orgasm.  I imagine women are supposed to say three hail mary's for each one they have as they aren't absolutely necessary for pregnancy.
Why is it so?
~Julius Sumner Miller
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