Posts: 67350
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
161
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:02 pm
(This post was last modified: November 1, 2023 at 3:06 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Whereas I don't have a negative view of religion, but sure enough anything christian does seem concerning and harmful. Christian universalism is concerning because of it's christianity, not it's universalism or it's religiosity. We must have already known that, though, choosing it as a subset for demonstration - just as I chose religious humanism on the other end.
I don't even know what the point of bickering about whether socially unacceptable versions of an ideology are benefitted by socially acceptable versions of the same is supposed to be. Maybe they don't have to, but they do.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 29959
Threads: 116
Joined: February 22, 2011
Reputation:
158
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:03 pm
(This post was last modified: November 1, 2023 at 3:05 pm by Angrboda.)
(November 1, 2023 at 2:55 pm)FrustratedFool Wrote: If a talented person invests their time becoming a preacher or apologist rather than scientist or poet because of the influence of universalist xtianity, that's a harm.
If someone gives money to the church rather than a better cause, that's a harm.
If fundamentalist xtians draw upon apologetic arguments created by universalists, that's a harm.
Atheists can suck, but atheism is neutral. Religion is always false and immoral and harmful in some way. That's the difference. The world would be better off without religion.
But let's compromise on one idea: the world would be better off with no religion except universalist progressive xtianity. Fair?
Your points above only hold true if you assume religion harmful a priori. That's begging the question.
Always harmful? So soup kitchens are harmful? Being happy is harmful?
Posts: 1535
Threads: 55
Joined: August 10, 2023
Reputation:
4
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:05 pm
(This post was last modified: November 1, 2023 at 3:06 pm by FrustratedFool.)
No. I explained the harm - the loss of talent, the loss of money. That is the harm.
No. Soup kitchens aren't harmful. But they don't require religion.
Posts: 29959
Threads: 116
Joined: February 22, 2011
Reputation:
158
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:08 pm
(This post was last modified: November 1, 2023 at 3:10 pm by Angrboda.)
(November 1, 2023 at 3:05 pm)FrustratedFool Wrote: No. I explained the harm - the loss of talent, the loss of money. That is the harm.
No. Soup kitchens aren't harmful. But they don't require religion.
It's only a loss because you define religion as bad you're using circular logic to justify your stand.
Soup kitchens needn't require whatever justification for them exists. They justify whatever rides on its coattails. And religions and religious are more charitable.
Posts: 67350
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
161
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:08 pm
(This post was last modified: November 1, 2023 at 3:10 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
An even simpler elaboration. In response to boyfucking, the rcc points to soup kitchens or daycares. Heavily subsidized soup kitchens and daycares run by boyfuckers...
Acceptable versions of a shitty religion (for novel values of acceptability) don't -have to- benefit from purportedly better versions of the same..but they do.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 1535
Threads: 55
Joined: August 10, 2023
Reputation:
4
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:19 pm
Are you saying that preaching the bible is better than being a scientist or teacher or historian or a doctor for civilisation? I assume that preaching the bible is useless at best.
Posts: 19881
Threads: 324
Joined: July 31, 2016
Reputation:
34
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:32 pm
(November 1, 2023 at 3:08 pm)Angrboda Wrote: And religions and religious are more charitable.
The military recruits too.
Posts: 67350
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
161
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:34 pm
(This post was last modified: November 1, 2023 at 3:36 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Religions and the religious are emphatically not more charitable. They make flashier and more absurd reports about their charity. The most charitable organizations on the planet by orders of magnitude are the very same secular governments who subsidize the religions the nuts perform for...a charity unto itself.
The "charity" that those nuts are reporting is..mostly.....them giving their money to prosperity gospel grifters. It's not exactly surprising that non-nuts are less charitable by the metrics of "did you give joel osteen any money this week/month/year".......
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 46627
Threads: 543
Joined: July 24, 2013
Reputation:
108
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:51 pm
(November 1, 2023 at 3:05 pm)FrustratedFool Wrote: No. I explained the harm - the loss of talent, the loss of money. That is the harm.
No. Soup kitchens aren't harmful. But they don't require religion.
I know of a lot of fiendishly talented religionists. If you think about it, so do you.
Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
Posts: 1535
Threads: 55
Joined: August 10, 2023
Reputation:
4
RE: Atheist Evangelism
November 1, 2023 at 3:58 pm
(November 1, 2023 at 3:51 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: (November 1, 2023 at 3:05 pm)FrustratedFool Wrote: No. I explained the harm - the loss of talent, the loss of money. That is the harm.
No. Soup kitchens aren't harmful. But they don't require religion.
I know of a lot of fiendishly talented religionists. If you think about it, so do you.
Boru
Many. That's why having their talents go into bible preaching is such a terrible waste. Not to mention the resources that go into the bible schools and Sunday schools and religious colleges etc. Great harm to civilisation. Think where we'd be if all the talented religionists throughout history had used their intelligence and skill in medicine and science and engineering and art rather than theology. Shame.
|
![[Image: extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg]](https://i.postimg.cc/zf86M5L7/extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg)
