This is one of the most boring and unimaginative trolls I've ever encountered. Forty-five posts, all in this one thread. As far as I'm concerned the joke's gone way beyond stale.

Didn't bother to sift through all 18 pages....

Basically - No atheist can prove 100% that there is no god and no theist can prove that there is one. However without being given evidence I have no reason to place stock in the idea that there is one either.

Whether or not there is a God of any kind is something we can't verify or disprove so we are left at a standstill. I know my religious views says Agnostic but I am still an atheist regarding the Christian, Muslim, and other religions gods. There is no verification and the deist version of God, if he exists, doesn't seem to care whatsoever about identifying himself.

Atheists are not irrational to hold their position anymore than you would be irrational for not believing that unicorns exist. Do these creatures exist? Perhaps but there is no evidence therefore it is rational to conclude they most likely do not exist.

As far as some atheists replacing religion with science there are always extremes. However do not mistake people's passion for religion. People are passionate about science because of what it has provided, continues to provide, and what it can potentially provide in the future. Among these things are answers to interesting questions, cures for diseases, new ways of doing things, and solving various other irritations in life. To be fair faith/prayer, aside from placebo affects + psychological effects, doesn't have any similar benefit.

How is it bad for people to trust in an idea that works?

However I suspect most would throw science off a cliff if it stopped working. If you drop an apple off a cliff and it repeatedly falls you are testing/proving gravity. That is not faith that is called observation and experimentation. If the apple randomly floated up and sometimes fell without any consistency you could say "Well FUCK GRAVITY".

(July 6, 2012 at 12:57 am)Stimbo Wrote: This is one of the most boring and unimaginative trolls I've ever encountered. Forty-five posts, all in this one thread. As far as I'm concerned the joke's gone way beyond stale.

That you consider me to be a troll, yet still have not addressed my point says more about those here. Only one has managed to admit it, and then gloss over it with an attempt to state that I dislike people in wheelchairs.

If it's stale, and you're not baking, don't eat.

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(July 6, 2012 at 1:22 am)Voltair Wrote: Didn't bother to sift through all 18 pages....

Basically - No atheist can prove 100% that there is no god and no theist can prove that there is one. However without being given evidence I have no reason to place stock in the idea that there is one either.

Whether or not there is a God of any kind is something we can't verify or disprove so we are left at a standstill. I know my religious views says Agnostic but I am still an atheist regarding the Christian, Muslim, and other religions gods. There is no verification and the deist version of God, if he exists, doesn't seem to care whatsoever about identifying himself.

Atheists are not irrational to hold their position anymore than you would be irrational for not believing that unicorns exist. Do these creatures exist? Perhaps but there is no evidence therefore it is rational to conclude they most likely do not exist.

As far as some atheists replacing religion with science there are always extremes. However do not mistake people's passion for religion. People are passionate about science because of what it has provided, continues to provide, and what it can potentially provide in the future. Among these things are answers to interesting questions, cures for diseases, new ways of doing things, and solving various other irritations in life. To be fair faith/prayer, aside from placebo affects + psychological effects, doesn't have any similar benefit.

How is it bad for people to trust in an idea that works?

However I suspect most would throw science off a cliff if it stopped working. If you drop an apple off a cliff and it repeatedly falls you are testing/proving gravity. That is not faith that is called observation and experimentation. If the apple randomly floated up and sometimes fell without any consistency you could say "Well FUCK GRAVITY".

You're welcome to call yourself agnostic, although I would say you're not as your position outlined above mirrors that of many atheists.

Defintion

The terms agnostic theist and agnostic atheist are redundant to me.

If you're an agnostic you have no reason to believe OR disbelieve.

You miss my point too, I never said there is no reason to mistrust science, in fact there is every reason to trust science.

What I've said is giving a scientist's belief more value on the basis of science being objective is odd, and just smells like faith akin to religion. An over-reaction backlash to religion by placing too much belief in science, is still an over reaction.

Yes, there are people who follow anything that science sells, and with great confidence that it is a given to work. However, as it has been said on this thread over and over again, science works. The difference, again, between religion and science is accountability. When science doesn't work, there are plenty of people who will not only point it out but prove it. Most religious adherents do the complete opposite; it's called apologetics.

You are making a generalization about a group of people who all hold completely different views on the existence of god. My ex is an atheist and has no opinion on the existence of god, other than that she has an absence of belief - a truer atheist, you will not find. She isn't particularly interested in science either, other than using what it provides to enrich her life. She trusts in science only when it works, and is quick to criticize reckless science where it occurs. How does she, for instance, fit your description of what an atheist is?

My da told me once that it takes a really big person to admit they are wrong - even when it sticks in their throat. I think you made a big mistake in your generalization of a group of people; and, given how you have tried since to lighten the general tone of the thread, I think you know it too.

Allow me to sum up the reason for Sellied's continued posts with a single emoticon.

I find it interesting that you think i thought all atheists believe what I wrote in my first post. I didn't and still don't, I was looking to bring out those that did. Only one has admitted it, which is unsurprising. Like I've said before, I've had these discussions before and most end at the pointds made in my first post. I'm still waiting to find an explanation of why so many atheists accept Hawking's perspective when is conjecture, it seems logic falls out the window when it suits their purposes. So similar to religion, all that happens is that scientists become a replacement for ministers.

I've tried to lighten the tone as I find it very boring to be hostile the whole time, and all that happens is it becomes a diversion from the point I'm making. To me the constant hostility just shows the emotion people have towards the subject, odd given it's meant to be a logically formed view.

As a rule, I don't like what atheists stand for, I can see no point in it. When I was an atheist, I was not actively one. If someone asked me, I just didn't believe. Now I've thought about it, I'm devoutly agnostic. I accept that everyone is different and believe different things, I just intensely dislike the supposed intellectual high-ground many atheists attempt to give themselves. It just reeks of self-righteousness, again like some religious groups.

Some people believe, I don't care, they're welcome to as long as they don't impinge on me. But why form a group to disbelieve in something, it makes no sense to me at all. For any one reading this and about to cite 9/11, paedophilia, religious corruption please don't bother, it doesn't convince me of anything. Of course, if you feel the need to cathartically purge why you hate religion so much, go ahead.

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(July 6, 2012 at 5:28 am)Creed of Heresy Wrote: Allow me to sum up the reason for Sellied's continued posts with a single emoticon.

Gringo - case and point. I don't know why they do it for acceptance amongst their peers, or are trying to annoy me.

You're getting close. Hope you remembered the lotion or it's gonna chafe.

(July 6, 2012 at 5:35 am)Selliedjoup Wrote: But why form a group to disbelieve in something, it makes no sense to me at all. For any one reading this and about to cite 9/11, paedophilia, religious corruption please don't bother, it doesn't convince me of anything. Of course, if you feel the need to cathartically purge why you hate religion so much, go ahead.

Then why the fuck are you here?

And why do I hate religion?

For all the stonings and the paedophile priests and the witch burnings and the pogroms and the ritual mutilations and the guilt trips for just being fucking born and the honor killings and the child exorcisms and the millions reaped for mega churches while millions starve and the threats of hell and the systematic denial of science in the name of a outdated and incoherent book and the persecution of gays and the enslavement of women and on and on and on.....

And all in the name of a gigantic and systematic LIE.

And if that isn't good enough fuck off.

(July 6, 2012 at 6:53 am)Zen Badger Wrote: Then why the fuck are you here?

And why do I hate religion?

For all the stonings and the paedophile priests and the witch burnings and the pogroms and the ritual mutilations and the guilt trips for just being fucking born and the honor killings and the child exorcisms and the millions reaped for mega churches while millions starve and the threats of hell and the systematic denial of science in the name of a outdated and incoherent book and on and on and on.....

And if that isn't good enough fuck off.

Very zen.

Can I hate atheism for Stalin, Pol Pot, etc.? I feel like that's the way a moron tries to learn:

"Herp derp, that other bad guy thought X was good. So X must really be bad! Herp a derp a derpadoo!"

(July 6, 2012 at 6:56 am)CliveStaples Wrote:

(July 6, 2012 at 6:53 am)Zen Badger Wrote: Then why the fuck are you here?

And why do I hate religion?

For all the stonings and the paedophile priests and the witch burnings and the pogroms and the ritual mutilations and the guilt trips for just being fucking born and the honor killings and the child exorcisms and the millions reaped for mega churches while millions starve and the threats of hell and the systematic denial of science in the name of a outdated and incoherent book and on and on and on.....

And if that isn't good enough fuck off.

Very zen.

Can I hate atheism for Stalin, Pol Pot, etc.? I feel like that's the way a moron tries to learn:

"Herp derp, that other bad guy thought X was good. So X must really be bad! Herp a derp a derpadoo!"

Show me where Pol Pot, Stalin etc did what they did in the name of Atheism.