Quote:At the end of Matthew 20, Jesus makes several implicit claims to deity. He assumed, for example, that
His life would be a pattern for ours. Only God has the right to assume that all people made in His image
should conform to His image, so that was an implicit claim of deity. And when He goes through the
poetic parallelism, He calls Himself the Son of Man who came to give His life as a ransom, which is
saying He is greater than great and also that His life can be a ransom for many. These are all points at
which Jesus makes implicit claims of deity

Welcome.

(August 31, 2012 at 10:20 am)Abel Wrote:

(August 31, 2012 at 9:33 am)FallentoReason Wrote: You being a Christian means you have faith in the God of the Bible. Answer me this: why does Jesus have to be human? Do you not have the faith that Paul was communicating with God Almighty through spiritual revelations of the mysteries of Christ Jesus as the epistles suggest?

Why so little faith?

Good Morning. I am new here and I am a born again Christian. I would like to answer this question you asked. Jesus had to be human because we are human. He died to pay the sin debt for all humans, so He too had to be one of us. In the O.T. they sacrificed bulls and goats as a temporary covering for sins, but as Hebrews points out, those sacrifices never completely removed sin. The blood of Christ will remove the sin and the stain it leaves.

Sure, theologically I know what you're saying. Is it fair to say Paul doesn't seem to mind how Jesus was crucified? He's content with his spiritual revelations of a Christ who was crucified and that's all he seems to talk about. There's no 3 year ministry to be found.

Quote:Paul communicated with the resurrected Jesus directly when on the road to Damascus. He communicated with Jesus personally on several occasions. He also received revelations through the Spirit as well.

Paul is the only one in the NT who claims to have encountered Jesus, only that it was a spiritual encounter.

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(August 31, 2012 at 10:24 am)CBA222 Wrote:

Quote:At the end of Matthew 20, Jesus makes several implicit claims to deity. He assumed, for example, that
His life would be a pattern for ours. Only God has the right to assume that all people made in His image
should conform to His image, so that was an implicit claim of deity. And when He goes through the
poetic parallelism, He calls Himself the Son of Man who came to give His life as a ransom, which is
saying He is greater than great and also that His life can be a ransom for many. These are all points at
which Jesus makes implicit claims of deity

Why should I trust what 'Matthew' says about Jesus? 'Matthew' never met him and actually used Mark as the basis for his Gospel.

(August 31, 2012 at 10:24 am)CBA222 Wrote:

Quote:At the end of Matthew 20, Jesus makes several implicit claims to deity. He assumed, for example, that
His life would be a pattern for ours. Only God has the right to assume that all people made in His image
should conform to His image, so that was an implicit claim of deity. And when He goes through the
poetic parallelism, He calls Himself the Son of Man who came to give His life as a ransom, which is
saying He is greater than great and also that His life can be a ransom for many. These are all points at
which Jesus makes implicit claims of deity

I just read through St Matt 20. No claim to divinity at all. St John is different and we know why, don't we? If you still say Jesus claimed to be GOd in St Matt, please provide me with the exact verse.

(August 31, 2012 at 10:20 am)Abel Wrote: Good Morning. I am new here and I am a born again Christian. I would like to answer this question you asked. Jesus had to be human because we are human. He died to pay the sin debt for all humans, so He too had to be one of us. In the O.T. they sacrificed bulls and goats as a temporary covering for sins, but as Hebrews points out, those sacrifices never completely removed sin. The blood of Christ will remove the sin and the stain it leaves.

Paul communicated with the resurrected Jesus directly when on the road to Damascus. He communicated with Jesus personally on several occasions. He also received revelations through the Spirit as well.

No, you do not get to join here, without any proper introduction and spew your rather weak apologetics to us and expect any attention.

TL;DR: Go blow jesus out of your ass.

(August 31, 2012 at 10:28 am)greneknight Wrote:

(August 31, 2012 at 10:24 am)CBA222 Wrote:

I just read through St Matt 20. No claim to divinity at all. St John is different and we know why, don't we? If you still say Jesus claimed to be GOd in St Matt, please provide me with the exact verse.

Any chance that if Jesus did claim to be god, he meant it in the sense that he like all of us are part of that god? When he says "I am the way" perhaps he refers to his example of finding god within, rather than some separate entity. [Admittedly, I don't actually read the bible so I only ask as an interested bystander.]

(August 31, 2012 at 10:15 am)greneknight Wrote:

(August 31, 2012 at 10:12 am)CBA222 Wrote: Several verses hint at it.

No. You've got to stretch the word a mile long. Name me one. In St John's Gospel, which was written MUCH later and the church had time to form its theology, the divinity assertion suddenly becomes forceful.

Actually there are several verses that confirm the Deity of Christ:
Peter affirms Jesus' deity: Mark 8:29 And he saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Peter answereth and saith unto him, Thou art the Christ.

Demons admit Jesus was God: Luke 4:41 And devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuking them suffered them not to speak: for they knew that he was Christ.

Jesus, Himself, said He was God: Mark 14:61-62 But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed? And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.

Because of this >

Quote:Jesus NEVER claimed to be God in the Synoptic Gospels.

too tired right now tmmrw guys.

(August 31, 2012 at 10:25 am)FallentoReason Wrote: Why should I trust what 'Matthew' says about Jesus? 'Matthew' never met him and actually used Mark as the basis for his Gospel.

Plus there is evidence that St Mattew cooked up some stories so that he could make Jesus fulfil some of the OT prophecies. St Matthew and the rest of the Evangelists aren't honest people. They had a strong agenda.

(August 31, 2012 at 10:31 am)LastPoet Wrote:

(August 31, 2012 at 10:20 am)Abel Wrote: Good Morning. I am new here and I am a born again Christian. I would like to answer this question you asked. Jesus had to be human because we are human. He died to pay the sin debt for all humans, so He too had to be one of us. In the O.T. they sacrificed bulls and goats as a temporary covering for sins, but as Hebrews points out, those sacrifices never completely removed sin. The blood of Christ will remove the sin and the stain it leaves.

Paul communicated with the resurrected Jesus directly when on the road to Damascus. He communicated with Jesus personally on several occasions. He also received revelations through the Spirit as well.

No, you do not get to join here, without any proper introduction and spew your rather weak apologetics to us and expect any attention.

TL;DR: Go blow jesus out of your ass.

Hello LastPoet. My name is Abel. I am a born again Christian. What else would like to know about me?

(August 31, 2012 at 10:38 am)greneknight Wrote:

(August 31, 2012 at 10:25 am)FallentoReason Wrote: Why should I trust what 'Matthew' says about Jesus? 'Matthew' never met him and actually used Mark as the basis for his Gospel.

Plus there is evidence that St Mattew cooked up some stories so that he could make Jesus fulfil some of the OT prophecies. St Matthew and the rest of the Evangelists aren't honest people. They had a strong agenda.

You continue to amaze me... Your set of beliefs is a rare one indeed.