I'm 16, and in school, so I can't get on due to all the homework lately. Also, I'm in school, surrounded by a melting pot of religions! Occasionally I'm asked which of the thousands I am. I reply by saying, "I'm an Atheist." They say, "What?! you don't believe in God?!?"

So I ask you fellow Atheists, what do you think is the best Atheistic argument(s)?

I think the best is to maintain your agnostic position and say that there is simply no evidence that any god exists. They will probably counter by saying that you can't disprove god and you can then say there is no way to prove a negative.

Rhizo

Countering you by saying you can't disprove god is one of the weakest Theistic arguments as leo mentioned in a similar thread. You can always say that the burden of proof falls upon them and not you because they are the one making the claim in the first place.

It's handy to know about the argument over causation that many Theists use when claiming god creating the world..etc..

I only learned about the burden of proof from this website, like much of my philosophical knowledge. Usually I only pursue knowledge that has a direct application to things going on in my life i.e. NW guide to mushrooms, theory of games and economic behavior, the Bible, the Necronomicon, the Satanic Bible, or even the Witches Bible. It never occured to me to seek out philosophical knowledge directly I mostly dealt with theology, metaphysics, or practical guides. I've read tons of fiction too.

Rhizo

I have learnt a lot from this forum as well. I've also started reading up quite a bit since I joined this forum. Very positive encouragement.

1. There's no evidence for God. Or rather, if there is, I don't know of any...Unless you can enlighten me...

2. Why is God required for an explanation for the universe but then God doesn't require one himself? If God doesn't need an explanation, then why does the universe need one? And isn't something like the Big Bang singularity far less complex and more probable?

3. For God to create a universe, he is more complex than the universe or he wouldn't be able to create it from scratch, and exist in the first place all without explanation - it's absurd.

4. The universe without God, is less complex and more probable than the universe + God until God is evidenced. Hence we're back to point '1.'.

5. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and God is, indeed, an extraordinary claim.

EvF

I think pointing out contradictions, inconsistencies, evil deeds done because of religion, absurdities of beliefs, (i.e. Christopher Hitchen's approach) is a good way to go.

It's also important to recognize where your strength in debating lies. What topics do you know best? What convinced you?

(September 23, 2009 at 11:02 am)EvidenceVsFaith Wrote:

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1. There's no evidence for God. Or rather, if there is, I don't know of any...Unless you can enlighten me...

2. Why is God required for an explanation for the universe but then God doesn't require one himself? If God doesn't need an explanation, then why does the universe need one? And isn't something like the Big Bang singularity far less complex and more probable?

3. For God to create a universe, he is more complex than the universe or he wouldn't be able to create it from scratch, and exist in the first place all without explanation - it's absurd.

4. The universe without God, is less complex and more probable than the universe + God until God is evidenced. Hence we're back to point '1.'.

5. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and God is, indeed, an extraordinary claim.

EvF

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Thank you all! I've known of many arguments, but I just needed something more potent to really stick it to them! I really like #2 and #5, 5 is one of my favorite quotes (as you may have seen!)

let be with you! (lol jk)

(September 23, 2009 at 11:02 am)EvidenceVsFaith Wrote: 2. Why is God required for an explanation for the universe but then God doesn't require one himself? If God doesn't need an explanation, then why does the universe need one? And isn't something like the Big Bang singularity far less complex and more probable?

If the universe doesn't need an explanation, then why does anything need an explanation? - That IS a really good one.

According to my worldview nothing needs an explaination. If there is an explaination then mores to the good. I would rather have a working, provable explaination based on evidence than resort to faith. I do understand how comforting the easy answer is though.

Rhizo