(December 9, 2012 at 8:22 pm)Al-Fatihah Wrote: Response: And if asked of what proof you have that Hitler or any of the people answered the challenge, your answer is "because a book says so", which any reasonable person can see is not proof. For saying so is not proof that it is so.

Furthermore, such evidence is hearssay, while the Qur'an challenge relies on a hands-on eyewitness account as evidence, , because anyone who takes the challenge will fail and not come close to answering it. And since it is clearly humanly impossible to use human-made speech/literature to achieve the act, then that means that the Qur'an that Muhammad used to inspire enough followers to conquer a nation was not the invention of any human/s, but from one who has greater power and authority than humans, and that is Allah.

A hands-on eyewitness account is more credible than hearsay. Thus your argument fails.

Says the man who just killed his own argument.

I quote historians and many, many hands-on eyewitnesses, including men who still live to this day who witnessed Hitler's rise to power. You only quote a book. Which by your own rules is not evidence. However, you have no hands-on eyewitnesses that you can bring to bear; nobody from that time period still exists who witnessed such a thing.

So, thank you kindly for destroying your own argument, saves me the trouble. :]

(December 9, 2012 at 8:22 pm)Al-Fatihah Wrote: Response: And if asked of what proof you have that Hitler or any of the people answered the challenge, your answer is "because a book says so", which any reasonable person can see is not proof. For saying so is not proof that it is so.
A hands-on eyewitness account is more credible than hearsay. Thus your argument fails.

*cringes*
Y-you do realize that...th-that your whole argument, that Muhammud even ever existed i-is based on something in a book that has far less documentation than a history book, r-right? *shudders*

(December 9, 2012 at 8:22 pm)Al-Fatihah Wrote:

(December 9, 2012 at 8:18 pm)Darkstar Wrote: If we wanted to conform so badly, we'd all be theists!

Response: Not on an atheist forum.

So what? Do you think no one here has been to a Christian forum before? You think this forum is our entire life?

(December 9, 2012 at 8:27 pm)Darkstar Wrote: *cringes*
Y-you do realize that...th-that your whole argument, that Muhammud even ever existed i-is based on something in a book that has far less documentation than a history book, r-right? *shudders*

I don't think he does, actually.

By the way, Mr. Muslim man...you might wanna get that bullet hole in your foot treated by a doctor pretty quick...that shit can get gangrenous.

(December 9, 2012 at 8:20 pm)Gooders1002 Wrote: Nope its not humanly impossible to inspire enough people to follow him/her to conquer a nation by using human made speech/literature that goes against the likes and beliefs of those people.
You just have to have a silver tough and have a gullible enough audience and they will follow you like sheep, its about mind manipulation and you can get almost anybody to believe anything Pen and Teller/Darren Brown do it often, as well as con men as a species we are incredibly gullible and the less intelligent you are the most gullible you are.
Why do you think religion focus on the kids, it's mental manipulation and you were manipulated to be closed minded from the day you could understand words, also less intelligent people back than are a lot easier to manipulate on mass. Hitler was great at manipulation as is all dictators. If Mohammed existed he probably was a great con man (with willing/unknowing accomplices who were literate) because he was also a merchant and there good with silver tongues in Arab countries.

Response: Once again, your logic that "You just have to have a silver tough and have a gullible enough audience and they will follow you like sheep" to inspire enough followers to conquer a nation by using humanmade speech that goes against their liking is suported by......Nothing. So you prove nothing as usual.

Meanwhile, the qur'an challenge proves that it is impossible because it provides a hands-on eyewitness account as evidence, because anyone who attempts to do so will fail.

Simply put, until you attempt to do it and prove otherwise, all you have is hot air as evidence. Debunked as usual.

(December 9, 2012 at 8:29 pm)Al-Fatihah Wrote: Meanwhile, the qur'an challenge proves that it is impossible because it provides a hands-on eyewitness account as evidence, because anyone who attempts to do so will fail.

Simply put, until you attempt to do it and prove otherwise, all you have is hot air as evidence. Debunked as usual.

And all you have as evidence is a book. Which you have said is not evidence.

So all you have is hot air as evidence, yourself.

Debunked. As usual.

(December 9, 2012 at 8:29 pm)Al-Fatihah Wrote: Response: Once again, your logic that "You just have to have a silver tough and have a gullible enough audience and they will follow you like sheep" to inspire enough followers to conquer a nation by using humanmade speech that goes against their liking is suported by......Nothing. So you prove nothing as usual.

How do you come to that conclusion? Or are we to suppose that Yahweh exists as well, after all, the crusades didn't happen for nothing!

(December 9, 2012 at 8:25 pm)Creed of Heresy Wrote: Says the man who just killed his own argument.

I quote historians and many, many hands-on eyewitnesses, including men who still live to this day who witnessed Hitler's rise to power. You only quote a book. Which by your own rules is not evidence. However, you have no hands-on eyewitnesses that you can bring to bear; nobody from that time period still exists who witnessed such a thing.

So, thank you kindly for destroying your own argument, saves me the trouble. :]

Response: Yet if asked how you know that these historians were eyewitnesses, your answer is "because they said so", thus you debunked yourself again. For it still relies on hearsay that the eyewitness were actually eyewitness.

The qur'an challenge on the other hand, provides a hands on-eyewitness account that inspiring enough followers to conquer a nation, or just the street you live on, by using human-made speech/literature that goes against what the people want is humanly impossible, because anyone who takes the challenge will fail and not come close to answering it. And since it is clearly humanly impossible to use human-made speech/literature to achieve the act, then that means that the Qur'an that Muhammad used to inspire enough followers to conquer a nation was not the invention of any human/s, but from one who has greater power and authority than humans, and that is Allah. Debunked as usual.

Like I had to school a Christian, I will do for you, eyewitness accounts only get you so far, and in court It can be dismissed altogether as what you saw and what you really saw are two very different things.
It boils down to the time between seeing and writing down and the reliability of a witness. That's Why CCTV is Used over eyewitness accounts as it what really happened (if the taped were secured) and not what you thought happened. Also the trouble with Eyewitness is that it can be warped over time (whether it be how there brain took the info wrongly or maliciously and deliberately changed in favour of one or the other party).

(December 9, 2012 at 8:32 pm)Al-Fatihah Wrote: Response: Yet if asked how you know that these historians were eyewitnesses, your answer is "because they said so", thus you debunked yourself again. For it still relies on hearsay that the eyewitness were actually eyewitness.

The qur'an challenge on the other hand, provides a hands on-eyewitness account that inspiring enough followers to conquer a nation, or just the street you live on, by using human-made speech/literature that goes against what the people want is humanly impossible, because anyone who takes the challenge will fail and not come close to answering it. And since it is clearly humanly impossible to use human-made speech/literature to achieve the act, then that means that the Qur'an that Muhammad used to inspire enough followers to conquer a nation was not the invention of any human/s, but from one who has greater power and authority than humans, and that is Allah. Debunked as usual.

Can you read!?! You are relying on hearsay that the challenge was fulfilled by Muhammud himself! You say it is impossible to do, so how do you know Muhammud ever did it!?!

(December 9, 2012 at 8:27 pm)Darkstar Wrote: Y-you do realize that...th-that your whole argument, that Muhammud even ever existed i-is based on something in a book that has far less documentation than a history book, r-right? *shudders*

Response: Not at all. Even so, the Qur'an can be proven as th true word of Allah from anhands-on eyewitness account as the challenge provides, while your alleged evidence cannot.

(December 9, 2012 at 8:27 pm)Darkstar Wrote: So what? Do you think no one here has been to a Christian forum before? You think this forum is our entire life?

Response: It doesn't matter to me if it was.

---

(December 9, 2012 at 8:31 pm)Creed of Heresy Wrote: And all you have as evidence is a book. Which you have said is not evidence.

So all you have is hot air as evidence, yourself.

Debunked. As usual.

Response: To the contrary, your own ducking and dodging to answer the qur'an challenge supports the fact that the Qur'an is true. Otherwise, you would have answered the challenge by now. Debunked as susual.