APA Revises Manual: Being Transgender Is No Longer A Mental Disorder

Quote:School districts in many states, including Colorado, have enacted policies that allow transgender students to use the bathroom of the gender with which they identify. Sixteen states, including Colorado, have anti-discrimination laws that include protections for transgender people.'

Her mother, Kathryn Mathis, recalls that as early as 18 months, Coy loved dresses and tutus. By age 2, she refused to leave the house dressed as a boy.
As a triplet, Coy has a brother and a sister, so the Mathis parents were able to watch one boy develop a male gender identity, while the other became ever more insistent about being female.

Read more: Pediatricians see growing number of crosss-gender kids like Coy Mathis - The Denver Post

(March 3, 2013 at 12:27 am)Aractus Wrote:

(March 2, 2013 at 11:22 pm)missluckie26 Wrote: Not to mention: guys' bathrooms are on a whole different playing field cleanliness wise.

Actually that's totally wrong. I know of buildings which have signs inside the ladies that say "wash your hands before leaving" and which do not have those signs inside the men's.

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(March 3, 2013 at 12:07 am)teaearlgreyhot Wrote: @Aractus

So we're not allowed to disagree with the school's decision?

Nonsense. You can disagree with it all you want, but it's still their decision to make.

Um, ok. What was the point of making that observation?

The fact that it's a SCHOOL MATTER and not a "public matter".

(March 3, 2013 at 1:59 am)Aractus Wrote: The fact that it's a SCHOOL MATTER and not a "public matter".

Um, ok.

Thank you Captain Obvious. You saved the day!

Quote:The fact that it's a SCHOOL MATTER and not a "public matter".

"The district firmly believes it has acted reasonably and fairly with respect to this issue," it said. "However [it] believes the appropriate and proper forum for discussing the issues identified in the charge is through the Division of Civil Rights process."

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/colorado-tr...d=18607443

EGross Wrote:When it comes to a 6 year old we are not talking about his sexual desires. We are talking about how he likes to dress up and play, and his parents are pushing a fantasy agenda "Pssst, don't call him a him". The bathroom is being used because it is the only point they can push because the school is living in a reality they don't want to share. They can't sue because the teacher refuses to use the feminin pronoun.

This really is not about the kid at all. He is their plaything. A 6 year old who has no sexual fetish, but just likes dolls and dressup.

Just because his parents are living on the planet "woo-woo" doesn't meant that the rest of the world has to go with it.

Please see my above post, this is totally about the kid.

The Mathis' have a set of triplets and two other children, Dakota, 8, and Auri, 2. The father, Jeremy Mathis, 31, is a former Marine who was honorably discharged with injuries. Kathryn Mathis, 27, is a certified nurse assistant and takes care of Coy's triplet, Lily who has been severely disabled since a viral infection after birth. She must be fed through an IV and is quadriplegic. "When she was able to be a girl," said Kathryn Mathis, "she blossomed."

Coy started kindergarten as a boy but soon became unhappy when classmates treated her like a boy. Being made to stand in the boys' line made her cry. Doctors diagnosed her with gender-identity disorder. After a few months in kindergarten, Coy's parents consulted with therapists and began to help her make the social transition from boy to girl.
"When the transition happened, some kids asked what happened, that Coy was a boy and is now a girl," said Kathryn Mathis. "The teacher said, 'Coy is a girl, and that's it.' Kids at that age are very accepting."

In December, officials in Fountain-Fort Carson School District 8 ruled Coy would have to use the boys' bathroom at Eagleside Elementary, or the staff or health-room restrooms. Her parents on Feb. 15 filed a complaint with the state Civil Rights Division.

Quote:In fact - when you send your child to a school, you are agreeing to abide by their rules.

And when a school opens under federal or state institution guidelines (and receive funding from those sources), if those state and/or federal guidelines change to accomodate a policy: they're expected to uphold said policy. Colorado policy seems to have revised it's definition of sexual orientation to include transgender status.

Colorado Revised Statute § 24-34-401
Definitions: (7.5) “Sexual orientation” means a person’s orientation toward heterosexuality, homosexuality, bisexuality, or transgender status
Statute breakdown by state

Quote:Schools have enough things to worry about without having renegade parents who are unhappy with the school rules that they agreed to when they sent their children there.

I highly doubt a family with five children, one of which is quadrapalegic (I've taken care of such a patient), are purposefully trying to be renegades. Seems more to me that they are trying to represent a minority population and it's social rights.


Pediatricians see growing number of cross-gender kids like Coy Mathis

"We're seeing it all across the state," said Dr. Daniel Reirden, a Children's Hospital Colorado physician who said his referrals "went up 200-fold" after he spoke on the issue of children and gender-identity disorder at a recent conference.
Described as "gender-variant," these children typically begin to demonstrate cross-gender behaviors between the ages of 2 and 4. They express a strong desire to live as the opposite gender — clothes, toys, pronouns.

Sometimes, it's typical preschool curiosity. But for other kids, it's the beginning of a life out of the ordinary, challenging societal expectations of what defines their gender.

Sex is assigned at birth according to biological status, but gender deals with the roles, behaviors, activities and expressions that society deems appropriate for males and females.

Children who are gender nonconforming are not considered to have mental disorders unless they experience great distress and discomfort at being unable to express who they believe they are.

As the general public becomes more aware of the issue through stories about kids such as Coy, the scientific community is also starting to expand its research into life cycles of transgender people to include children.
By granting equal treatment under the law, we can ease the pain of inter-generational trauma experienced by the transgender community which has been perpetuated for years.

(March 3, 2013 at 1:59 am)Aractus Wrote: The fact that it's a SCHOOL MATTER and not a "public matter".

Whilst I sympathise with your position that the actual subject matter as how it relates to the school is indeed a decision made by the school, I think what other people are trying to say is that the decision made is grounded int he social aspect. Whether the school believes the girl is wrong to be as she is or not, it's highly likely that the issue at hand is that they don't want reprisals from bigoted parents.

(March 3, 2013 at 1:59 am)Aractus Wrote: The fact that it's a SCHOOL MATTER and not a "public matter".

Well, since this IS a public school, school matters ARE public matters.

But even if it was a private school, I'm still allowed to think the decision is full of shit.

(March 3, 2013 at 12:07 am)teaearlgreyhot Wrote: @Aractus

So we're not allowed to disagree with the school's decision?

You can disagree all you want, that doesn't mean you get to decide school policy. I disagree with a lot of taxes, it doesn't mean I don't have to pay them.

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(March 2, 2013 at 10:47 pm)TaraJo Wrote: And, no, I don't think she's confused. My standing rule is, if someone personally identifies as a girl, I treat them like a girl. I know some people think she's bit young, but at what age do we decide she's not too young to determine her gender? At 10? Or 12? Or 16 or 18? The longer you wait, the more difficult transition is, especially after puberty sets in and you start having to deal with hormones you don't want. If she's allowed to transition now, she may be able to avoid growing facial hair (saving her time, money and pain from electrolysis), more masculine build (making clothes shopping more difficult) and a deepening voice. I don't want to be the one who tells a young lady that she has to undergo boy-puberty before I'll consider her a girl; do you?

I would be very surprised if a 6 year old was articulate enough to express their gender. Playing with dolls and liking dresses does not mean that a parent should determine something that will majorly affect them for the rest of their life. You can't get a 6 year old to tell you what they want for dinner but you think they can make gender identity decisions?

Also if you say you decided your gender that early, I'd say that you are projecting. Hormone levels also aren't that different between 6 year old boys and girls. All of those concerns of yours won't happen until puberty anyway.

Completely wrong to do that

(February 27, 2013 at 5:15 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: Honestly, I'm just surprised that transsexuality is emerging that young in people.

Honestly, I'm not.

But then, I'm honestly confused by the whole 'standing up to pee' nonsense... so clearly my line of thought is an outlier

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(February 27, 2013 at 5:35 pm)futilethewinds Wrote: That poor little girl should be able to go to whatever restroom she wants. She'll have her own stall. Who does it hurt?

I imagine it hurts the sensibilities of the school board and principle... I'm mildly aghast that the girl's parents would reveal such publicly when she's 6. SIX.

I couldn't handle the resultant bullying and social ostracization at twice her age.

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(February 28, 2013 at 3:22 pm)Psykhronic Wrote: We are dead if someone with a penis wants to use the woman's restroom. HOW CAN WE DEAL WITH THIS!?

Obviously, rape is the answer.

That'll show em.

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(February 28, 2013 at 3:29 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

(February 27, 2013 at 5:15 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: Honestly, I'm just surprised that transsexuality is emerging that young in people.

Yeah....

Quote:The parents of a transgender 6-year-old

I wonder where the kid got that idea from?

Totally with you, by the way.

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(February 28, 2013 at 5:14 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: I agree. This may be the first time I have ever agreed with you. I mean, seriously, even if he really does feel like he should have been a different gender at that age, I can't really believe that a kid should be that utterly sure of his own sexual identity when he's freaking six. He should at least wait until puberty. He may have grown out of it by that time.

Or... more likely... said child may enjoy testosterone. I'd hesitate to declare the child's gender now that it's been thrown up in the air... and at the moment, I'd defer to what the child is supposedly claiming (she).

Gender isn't necessarily set in stone, but I like to respect the gender of others enough to go with their call... nonetheless, one can't help but wonder now.

Hehe... I'm reminded of when I was like, 5... and out on a skiff, my eldest brother told me that my seasickness was morning sickness, and I told him 'you must be right, I'm pregnant'.



But then... I was also cutting the penis off of Ken when I was 6, so there may infact be something to this

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(February 28, 2013 at 5:31 pm)plaincents Wrote: I think I gotta side with the OP on this one.

I'm curious about how a 6 year old came to question their own sexuality at such a young age. I mean, I might be talking out my ass here, but at 6 I wasn't wondering about my sexuality or gender. I was wondering how to stop the excessive bleeding from my Stretch Armstrong. It just seems a little...off...for someone that young to be considering topics of gender without outside influence (i.e. the parents).

Or rape. I dunno... there's something about seeing a man's penis that makes one a little curious.

I was giving consensual blowjobs by my eighth birthday, doesn't seem completely unreasonable to me that (perhaps given certain conditions) someone might consider gender/sexuality by 6... certainly, it would not be such a fully-thought through understanding as that of someone thirty and aging... but it's wholly possible that the basic forms of this understanding (am I a girl? I really like boys) could occur by six.

Ultimately... if this child isn't a girl, they're probably a little bit gay

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(February 28, 2013 at 5:33 pm)Ryantology Wrote: See, I understand why you hate gay people. But, an atheist has no recourse to base that hatred on the Bible, as you do. I'm curious to see what makes an atheist justify arbitrary discrimination against gay people.

It's icky.

Justified.

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(March 1, 2013 at 5:20 am)rexbeccarox Wrote: Regardless of my opinion on whether a kid is transgender at the age of six (although, for the record, I don't find it improbable), I think it's despicable that children at that age are being sexualized. If a little kid, who happens to have a penis, wants to wear dresses, play with dolls, and feels more comfortable going to the little girls' room instead of the boys... where there are stalls (ferfucksake), what's the big deal? Making a thing out of it ("it" meaning, I guess, nudity? What are they concerned about, really?) sexualizes kids when they're far too young to understand what sex is.

Oh, I think that they can grasp 'what sex is' readily enough... we're talking about beings that can grasp simple mathematics and language and social skills. If a cow of any age can understand 'what sex is': a child of six certainly can.

Note... not that they necessarily should, but the potential is larger than you seem to give them credit for. I think when I was six, me and my sister had a short session of looking at each others' privates... and I for one was startled that they weren't the same. Wasn't until I started seeing boy's privates that I became really confused and concerned

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(March 1, 2013 at 5:47 am)EGross Wrote: I am not sure what the issue is. Don't they know that the lines to the boys room are much shorter?

But seriously, if a kid decides he is feeling pretty old, and puts on a grey wig and stuff, and goes to a movie theater and demands the pensioner price, he can probably play dress up all he wants, but that does not change his status as a minor. And if the school has a rule that boys use the lav with "boys" written on it, then it doesn't matter if you play dress up or not, you stick with the rules, work with the system, or go someplace where they are devoid of such rules. And I can put on black face, but I still won't get the special Ethiopian discount for medical school here.

Are we on about that arbitrary age line bullshit? Nah, surely we're completely past that level of asinine retardation by now.

Because being a girl and using the boys room has anything to do with dressing up? If indeed the child in question *is* transsexual, then she doesn't apply to the given rule, and the parents have every right to complain that their little girl is being sent to the boys' lavatory.

I mean... wouldn't you express some concern if your little girl was being ordered away from the girl's room and into the little soldier's room instead?

Quote:This is an opportunity for the parents to teach about rules and boundries, rather than teach that there aren't any.

Alternately... this is an opportunity to teach about *sensible* rules and boundaries vs *non-sensible* rules and boundaries... both of which exist in this world aplenty. A rule stating you wear your shoes on your head is no less ridiculous than one which sends girls into boys restrooms... it's simply not done

So one wonders why it is allowed here

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(March 1, 2013 at 6:05 am)rexbeccarox Wrote: I'm of the opinion that social rules and boundaries are often so arbitrary that they should not only be broken, but exploded. Kids should change the rules, no blindly abide by them.

And yet one more person observes how it is that religious instruction manages to get to children so well

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(March 1, 2013 at 10:59 am)John V Wrote: If she says she's a girl, then she is a girl, regardless of biology...or at least that's what was argued to me in another thread.

If she says she's a girl, she's probably a girl. People at that age can undergo rapid and massive changes, so she may not always be a girl... but evidence suggests that either she's a girl, or she's a gay boy

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(March 1, 2013 at 6:25 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: And here's something I've just noticed: Where are our resident transsexuals? VLB and Tara should probably be putting their 2 cents in, because, quite frankly, since everyone in this discussion (at least as far as I know) seems to be okay with the set of genitalia we were born with, we're clearly in the dark.

You know... work, and stuff. Part time, but glad to have it. Work and video games and something about a phone on a recovery loop.

I wouldn't say 'in the dark', because your experiences involving your genitalia are real, valid, and observable experiences by which you've formed your various conjecture. Me, I've just had a different, more consistently negative experience with mine.

Honest, genitalia *really* doesn't matter much (if at all?) by that age... and prepubescent observations of gender are more an attempt to hem our children into out own images than anything else. Girl or boy... doesn't really matter at all at that age, it's a person. I, for one, am more interested in them expressing themselves (within some wide-reaching social constraints (not shitting on someone in public)) than in them expressing their similarities to a group of people.

Unfortunately, they're going to compare themselves to people regardless... and if most of the girls they know are more like them than most of the boys they know, it's wholly valid for them to rationalize this by believing that they are one and the same (if you're going to keep dichotomizing children as boys and girls, there will be consequences... and this is one of them).