(June 4, 2013 at 11:23 pm)smax Wrote:

(June 4, 2013 at 11:12 pm)catfish Wrote: In other words, you're not capable of discussing scripture, got it...

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How to shut up morons who quote scripture: Quote scripture back.

Yeah, we will see how that theory of yours plays out with others.

Yeppers, just like we see how the attempted use of scripture backfired on your unknowledgable ass. You may join the ranks of the fucking crybabies now, I think I've fed you too much.

(June 4, 2013 at 10:01 pm)catfish Wrote:

(June 4, 2013 at 6:03 am)pocaracas Wrote: Cat never claimed to be a member of any church, has he?
And since when does believing require a (conscious) reason?
Cat has been indoctrinated, but has found some things to be BS, so he shunned those things from his belief. He still believes, though...

No church affiliation for me.
However, I was anything except indoctrinated. I maybe went to church 2 or 3 times up till I was 12.

You know?... you don't need to go to church to be indoctrinated.
All that's required is that the people you grow up with provide some positive reinforcement to the truthfulness of the god claim.

(June 4, 2013 at 10:01 pm)catfish Wrote:

(June 4, 2013 at 6:03 am)pocaracas Wrote: Tiny question: if that Hebrew word can be best represented by another word, why was it translated to "kill"?

I cannot answer except to speculate. Perhaps to stop all the dumbfucks from "accidently" running over the hot neighbors' husbands with horse and buggies. Remember, this is only speculation.

LOL!

(June 4, 2013 at 10:01 pm)catfish Wrote: Bigger (dumb) question: Why would they translate a Hebrew word that could mean either rope or camel to camel? Who the Hades picked camel?!?!?

I have no idea where you're coming from with this one...

Well, within the context of trying to feed it through the eye of the needle, which translation would you assume to be correct? Lol

I suspect the "Camel" translation was used to emphasise the point that it's supposed to be impossible for a rich man to get into heaven.

(May 21, 2013 at 4:57 pm)Just Chilling Wrote:

Seems you're confused about regret, God did not end the lives of everything in world because they were created, it was because they had become so evil. Now how is it that a unborn child can be evil, you need to make comparisons that are equal in nature, oranges and apples thing you know.

(May 21, 2013 at 4:57 pm)Just Chilling Wrote:

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You see, when GOD does it it's A-okay, but you yourself, you can't just do with your body what you please, that's a big no-no! Next thing you know people started thinking independent thoughts, where would it end?!

(June 4, 2013 at 11:27 pm)catfish Wrote: You may join the ranks of the fucking crybabies now, I think I've fed you too much.

Projecting, much?

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Also, Ockham's Razor time: Gotta prove the existence of god before any of the claims about him are valid anyway.

I notice we all seem to fall prey to that whole thing. We love arguing the finer points, and I especially love it, but when you cut to the point, suddenly none of it has any bearing.

Proselytizing and discussions about religions always have one thing in common; they ultimately are pointless. It's like discussing how many feathers an angel's wings have; it's fun to talk about in the context of if it were real but the fact remains there's nothing to the claims to begin with.

Suddenly takes the wind out of the whole thing.

(June 5, 2013 at 4:30 am)pocaracas Wrote: You know?... you don't need to go to church to be indoctrinated.
All that's required is that the people you grow up with provide some positive reinforcement to the truthfulness of the god claim.

No, still wasn't "indoctrinated". If anything I helped de-indoctrinate my dad who was an ex-Catholic.
I was more drawn to what was wrong about the Bible than to what was "truth". I was asked my opinion of passages and I was never told or coerced into believing anything.

(June 5, 2013 at 4:30 am)pocaracas Wrote:

(June 4, 2013 at 10:01 pm)catfish Wrote: Bigger (dumb) question: Why would they translate a Hebrew word that could mean either rope or camel to camel? Who the Hades picked camel?!?!?

I have no idea where you're coming from with this one...

"It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter heaven".

Rope would have been an anolgy that (sh)would be understood, "camel" just requires a whole shitload of appologetics to make it even remotely appear to be the intended meaning. Your interpretation may vary.

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(June 5, 2013 at 11:21 am)Creed of Heresy Wrote:

(June 4, 2013 at 11:27 pm)catfish Wrote: You may join the ranks of the fucking crybabies now, I think I've fed you too much.

Projecting, much?

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Also, Ockham's Razor time: Gotta prove the existence of god before any of the claims about him are valid anyway.

I notice we all seem to fall prey to that whole thing. We love arguing the finer points, and I especially love it, but when you cut to the point, suddenly none of it has any bearing.

Proselytizing and discussions about religions always have one thing in common; they ultimately are pointless. It's like discussing how many feathers an angel's wings have; it's fun to talk about in the context of if it were real but the fact remains there's nothing to the claims to begin with.

Suddenly takes the wind out of the whole thing.

I tried getting "right to the point", it made ya'all pretty fucking mad...

"No definitive tests to diagnose mental disorders blah blah blah" and "A zygote/fetus is an individual human lifeform"

Damn crybaby.

(June 5, 2013 at 8:51 am)littleendian Wrote: You see, when GOD does it it's A-okay, but you yourself, you can't just do with your body what you please, that's a big no-no! Next thing you know people started thinking independent thoughts, where would it end?!

Why are you intentionally being dishonest? He just showed why the comparison is not equal. If aborted babies/fetus'/parasites/pokemon were known to be evil, it would be okay, basically.

(June 5, 2013 at 1:28 pm)catfish Wrote:

(June 5, 2013 at 4:30 am)pocaracas Wrote: I have no idea where you're coming from with this one...

"It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter heaven".

Rope would have been an anolgy that (sh)would be understood, "camel" just requires a whole shitload of appologetics to make it even remotely appear to be the intended meaning. Your interpretation may vary.

I was under the impression that the OT was written in greek, or aramaic... not hebrew....
Went looking for it... and found this: http://www.catholic.com/quickquestions/w...-or-hebrew
Looks like the people who translated into english, used the greek version...
Although the original was indeed in aramaic (which seems to be the same as hebrew... the things I learn with you!).

I looked up the passage here: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?sea...R1550;NRSV
With the leap of faith that the greek language didn't change that much between the 2nd Century and the 16th.

Then I plugged that into google translator and the word used in that passage for camel is: καμηλον
And google only provides camel as a translation for it.
I went the other way around and saw what does camel translate to in greek: καμήλα, κάμηλος, καμηλό

Let's look at these greek letters and see if maths was useful for something
κ = k (no brainer!)
α = a (alpha)
μ = m (mu)
ή = e (eta)
λ = l (lambda)
ο = o (no brainer... )
ν = n (niu)

It says camelon... the alternative translations go to camela, camelo... hmmm I don't know what this greek letter is ς... maybe it looks too different when the professor write it.

What does google say that rope translates to?
σκοινί (skoini ?)
τριχιά (trixia ?)
σχοινίο (sxoinio ?)

Nothing here is remotely similar to camel...

So, the original translation from aramaic to greek must be the flawed one.
But since we do not have any of the original aramaic versions... how do you know that the man used a word that could be translated to camel and rope?
OK, let's try that... google also translates to hebrew!

Rope: (dammit, this thing makes me write right to left! There are 3 options here, separated by commas) עֲבוֹת , יֶתֶר ,
חֶבֶל

Camel: (only one option) גָמָל


Camel doesn't look a lot like rope, to me... but hebrew may have evolved too... I don't know... in case you haven't noticed, I know nothing of greek, nor hebrew/aramaic, except for what google tells me.

pocaracas, sorry about that, I meant Aramaic and not Hebrew.

http://www.eyeoftheneedle.net/Church%20T...needle.htm