(November 5, 2013 at 4:03 pm)ronedee Wrote: A "true" Christian is the one who [lives by] Christs' teachings.

I can't believe I have to spoon feed you guys. You can say you are anything.... maybe even an atheist! But you might be a scumbag!

Actually, its harder to tell in your cases. At least there is a standard for Chrisitans.

Can we be deceived? You bet! But usually not for long. You can't serve 2 gods. One eventually wins out.

But you see we're back at the major crux of the problem. You are clueless to Gods ways. We Christians have the Holy Spirit to guide us! You? Again....its hard to tell. You're as scattered as scared sheep!

I do wish you could experience the Holy Spirit! Even for a moment. Its like you woke-up up from a deep, dreamless sleep!

And, I wish I could tell you more about experiencing the Holy Spirit! But alas...you would just shit all over it!

God either wants you... or not! I, nor YOU have anything to do with it!

This is basically dick-waving through an iron fence....with neither of us wanting to step onto the other side of it!

The condescension just oozes from your words as you strut around attempting to demonstrate your superiority.

I'm going to go look at the bible right now and see if I can find the verse where Jesus says go be an arrogant cocksucker to anyone with different beliefs. Judging by your behavior, it has to be in there.

(November 5, 2013 at 4:03 pm)ronedee Wrote: A "true" Christian is the one who [lives by] Christs' teachings.

I think that's a fair way to put it. But it splits "Christians" into two groups; the ones that are counted when someone wants to make an argumentum ad populum, and the ones that are left when the behavior of most of the former group is pointed out. My guess is that the latter group is extraordinarily small.

(November 5, 2013 at 4:03 pm)ronedee Wrote: A "true" Christian is the one who [lives by] Christs' teachings.

I have yet to meet a christian who meets that criteria. The best that has been achieved is to follow some of christ's teachings

Quote:Actually, its harder to tell in your cases. At least there is a standard for Chrisitans.

The only standard for christianity is a belief in Jesus. That's it. No more.

Quote:Can we be deceived? You bet! But usually not for long.

I only quoted that because I wanted to read it again. It makes me chuckle.

Quote:But you see we're back at the major crux of the problem. You are clueless to Gods ways. We Christians have the Holy Spirit to guide us! You? Again....its hard to tell. You're as scattered as scared sheep!

There are an estimated 43,000 different denominations of christianity. One church even split due to an argument over whether or not adam had a bellybutton. I shit you not; it resulted in a church called the navalites.

So tell me again about this amazing christian unity of yours.

If the holy spirit is guiding you, i think you'd be better off getting a satnav.

Quote:Ido wish you could experience the Holy Spirit! Even for a moment. Its like you woke-up up from a deep, dreamless sleep!

You're forgetting that many/most atheists are former christians thelmselves. They know exactly what you're talking about and they rejected it after realising it was a load of equine excreta.

Quote:This is basically dick-waving through an iron fence....with neither of us wanting to step onto the other side of it!

Apart from those that already have, of course.

(November 6, 2013 at 10:18 am)ronedee Wrote:

(November 6, 2013 at 8:02 am)Brakeman Wrote: 1 Peter 3:15

New International Version (NIV)

15 But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect,

2 Corinthians 10:5

New International Version (NIV)

5 We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ.

{que GC's snarky excuse machine:}

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
New International Version (NIV)

Matt 7:6

"Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.

So we unbelievers are pigs now are we? How did you come to that conclusion without judging us?

Luke 6:37
New International Version
"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

(just a reminder..)

---

(November 6, 2013 at 10:16 am)Drich Wrote: You said 'morality.' In Hitler's germany it was considered 'immoral' to allow a jew to escape the 'final solution.'

I'm curious, why do you think the predominately catholic Germans hated the jews?

Ooh, I know that one! It's because Fanta put psychotropic drugs in all their drinks.

10 point to me, I think you'll find

(November 6, 2013 at 10:16 am)Drich Wrote:

(November 2, 2013 at 12:16 pm)Simon Moon Wrote: Substitutionary atonement is a ridiculous and immoral doctrine.

You said 'morality.' In Hitler's germany it was considered 'immoral' to allow a jew to escape the 'final solution.' In Osama's community it was a 'moral' obligation to fly planes into buildings. When 'morality' is tied to pop culture, 'morality' is anything but righteous, and the kicker? The people who are tied to this brand of 'morality' are too close to it to ever see the evil in their own hearts.

Well, I would be the first to agree that these are great and well-established examples of Christian and Islamic morals, respectively, but I fail to see the point in you bringing them up here.

Quote: Which is a bad thing? how so? if your 'morality' is based on popular belief, and no real standards of any kind then how can you possiable know if what you are doing is truly 'moral'/Righteous?

I suppose we can invent a higher power to endorse our moral code so that idiots believe that our moral code is better than everybody else's. You are a perfect example of how well that approach works.

(November 6, 2013 at 6:36 pm)Brakeman Wrote:

(November 6, 2013 at 10:18 am)ronedee Wrote: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
New International Version (NIV)

Matt 7:6

"Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.

So we unbelievers are pigs now are we? How did you come to that conclusion without judging us?

Luke 6:37
New International Version
"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

(just a reminder..)

If the hoof fits!

I didn't write those words...but they are handy!

Jesus turned His cheek, which I admire. And YES! I do forgive you! Thanks for the reminder!

(November 6, 2013 at 7:01 pm)ronedee Wrote: Jesus turned His cheek, which I admire. And YES! I do forgive you! Thanks for the reminder!

You're welcome. And just a reminder, if you ever did convince me that god was real and you really helped me save my soul, I would be so extremely grateful. I am only derisive because I don't believe a word of it.

(November 6, 2013 at 7:06 pm)Brakeman Wrote:

(November 6, 2013 at 7:01 pm)ronedee Wrote: Jesus turned His cheek, which I admire. And YES! I do forgive you! Thanks for the reminder!

You're welcome. And just a reminder, if you ever did convince me that god was real and you really helped me save my soul, I would be so extremely grateful. I am only derisive because I don't believe a word of it.

You don't have to believe a word of it. Marry a believer and you're golden.

(November 6, 2013 at 2:47 pm)Optimistic Mysanthrope Wrote: I have yet to meet a christian who meets that criteria. The best that has been achieved is to follow some of christ's teachings

The only standard for christianity is a belief in Jesus. That's it. No more.

There are an estimated 43,000 different denominations of christianity. One church even split due to an argument over whether or not adam had a bellybutton. I shit you not; it resulted in a church called the navalites.

So tell me again about this amazing christian unity of yours.

If the holy spirit is guiding you, i think you'd be better off getting a satnav.

I know several "true" Christians. If you don't associate with them on a spiritual level how can you judge them to be spiritual? Do you even know what constitutes a "spiritual" state of being?

And conversely I know several "false" Christians. Some in my own extended family! And the funny thing is they believe they are "true" Christians! My father who is an atheist, and my brother who is an agnostic are more trusted by me, than most of the "false" Christians I know!

So there you have it!

(November 6, 2013 at 2:47 pm)Optimistic Mysanthrope Wrote: You're forgetting that many/most atheists are former christians thelmselves. They know exactly what you're talking about and they rejected it after realising it was a load of equine excreta.

No. They don't know "exactly" what I'm talking about!

To "know" the Holy Spirit is a life changing experience! There is NO turning away.

What they "reject" is what they "don't know". And frankly... which may surprise you.... I don't blame them at all.

What I do blame, is ignorance of what isn't known!

I respect my "kid" brother much more than my father in their views of religion! Although my brother "won't" believe, his mind is totally open. My father on the other hand? Totally close-minded about the existence of God.

But, fear drives my fathers anger. Apathy (from God) drives my brother's argument.

So, I've had more conversations, and arguments about God w/ anti's & aggy's than I can count! Much to the dismay of family gatherings! We can clear a room in under a minute!