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Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
#1
Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
Mark 5:2-13
King James Version (KJV)

2 And when he was come out of the ship, immediately there met him out of the tombs a man with an unclean spirit,

3 Who had his dwelling among the tombs; and no man could bind him, no, not with chains:

4 Because that he had been often bound with fetters and chains, and the chains had been plucked asunder by him, and the fetters broken in pieces: neither could any man tame him.

5 And always, night and day, he was in the mountains, and in the tombs, crying, and cutting himself with stones.

6 But when he saw Jesus afar off, he ran and worshipped him,

7 And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not.

8 For he said unto him, Come out of the man, thou unclean spirit.

9 And he asked him, What is thy name? And he answered, saying, My name is Legion: for we are many.

10 And he besought him much that he would not send them away out of the country.

11 Now there was there nigh unto the mountains a great herd of swine feeding.

12 And all the devils besought him, saying, Send us into the swine, that we may enter into them.

13 And forthwith Jesus gave them leave. And the unclean spirits went out, and entered into the swine: and the herd ran violently down a steep place into the sea, (they were about two thousand) and were choked in the sea.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?sea...ersion=KJV

So my initial questions are:
1. Where did the man's will and the demon's will start and end?
2. How did the possessed man recognize jesus? If the demon's told him that jesus was real and identified him, isn't that an unfair advantage? Why can't demons tell all of us which god is real?
3. If the man's free will is strong enough to drag the demons within him toward jesus, why couldn't he have excised them himself?
4. Why would the demons relinquish control since they obviously knew that meeting jesus wouldn't go well for them?
5. Why would a loving god allow demon possession?
6. What happened to the demons ultimately? From the story, it appeared as though they died. Can demon's simply die and no longer exist?
7. Why did the demons drive the pigs into the sea to drown?
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#2
RE: Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
Can any other atheists think of additional questions about these verses?
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#3
RE: Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
No...the demon never said Jesus was God, he said Son of God. Legion knew Jesus had access to God's power because of his doings, as it is mentioned in Luke Chapter 11 Verse Number 20:

"I with the finger of God cast out devils"

Matthew 12:28:

"I cast out devils by the Spirit of God"

So Legion knew Jesus had authority over them. What was he going to do? Attack Jesus? He knew better. His miracle, in Mark 1:23-26:

"And immediately there was in their synagogue a man with an unclean spirit. And he cried out, “What have you to do with us, Jesus of Nazareth? Have you come to destroy us? I know who you are—the Holy One of God.” But Jesus rebuked him, saying, “Be silent, and come out of him!” And the unclean spirit, convulsing him and crying out with a loud voice, came out of him."
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#4
RE: Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
Did Jesus make the pigs rush into the sea and drown? Did the owner of the pigs get reimbursed for Jesus' mistake if he wasn't the one who made the pigs rush into the ocean? If demons can't control people or animals, what's the point of possession?
Poe's Law: "Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism that SOMEONE won't mistake for the real thing."

10 Christ-like figures that predate Jesus. Link shortened to Chris ate Jesus for some reason...
http://listverse.com/2009/04/13/10-chris...ate-jesus/

Good video to watch, if you want to know how common the Jesus story really is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88GTUXvp-50

A list of biblical contradictions from the infallible word of Yahweh.
http://infidels.org/library/modern/jim_m...tions.html

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#5
RE: Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
(December 15, 2013 at 11:51 am)Chad32 Wrote: Did Jesus make the pigs rush into the sea and drown? Did the owner of the pigs get reimbursed for Jesus' mistake if he wasn't the one who made the pigs rush into the ocean? If demons can't control people or animals, what's the point of possession?

Jesus was an outlaw, he also turned water into wine...without a license.

The demons have full control over the body and the possessed body no longer has any free will of its own according to the Bible.
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#6
RE: Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
Yeah, but if Jesus really killed the pigs on purpose, that would be a dick move. To the pigs, the owner of the pigs, and even kind of to the demons. That's like if you have a gun, and a guy says please don't shoot him, and you say ok you can go. Then you stab the guy in the back with a knife.
Poe's Law: "Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism that SOMEONE won't mistake for the real thing."

10 Christ-like figures that predate Jesus. Link shortened to Chris ate Jesus for some reason...
http://listverse.com/2009/04/13/10-chris...ate-jesus/

Good video to watch, if you want to know how common the Jesus story really is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88GTUXvp-50

A list of biblical contradictions from the infallible word of Yahweh.
http://infidels.org/library/modern/jim_m...tions.html

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#7
RE: Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
(December 15, 2013 at 12:21 pm)Chad32 Wrote: Yeah, but if Jesus really killed the pigs on purpose, that would be a dick move. To the pigs, the owner of the pigs, and even kind of to the demons. That's like if you have a gun, and a guy says please don't shoot him, and you say ok you can go. Then you stab the guy in the back with a knife.

Yes but doesn't Jesus say in the Gospel of Luke 19:27:

"But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them--bring them here and kill them in front of me.'"
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#8
RE: Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
Yes he did say that. He was nicer than Yahweh, and I am of the belief that he was a different person, but he said and did some contradictory things too. Almost like the people that wrote about him decades after his death didn't have a clear understanding of him.
Poe's Law: "Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism that SOMEONE won't mistake for the real thing."

10 Christ-like figures that predate Jesus. Link shortened to Chris ate Jesus for some reason...
http://listverse.com/2009/04/13/10-chris...ate-jesus/

Good video to watch, if you want to know how common the Jesus story really is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88GTUXvp-50

A list of biblical contradictions from the infallible word of Yahweh.
http://infidels.org/library/modern/jim_m...tions.html

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#9
RE: Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
Here is a sermon on the topic. It should answer your questions:

http://www.swedenborg.org/sermons/pastse...t_Out.aspx
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#10
RE: Can christians here explain Mark 5:2-13?
(December 15, 2013 at 1:13 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: Here is a sermon on the topic. It should answer your questions:

http://www.swedenborg.org/sermons/pastse...t_Out.aspx

That sermon is such a poor read. It is so tangled and frothy. The goal of communication is clarity of idea transmission. That word salad is pathetic.

Picking out the raisins, The Preacher claims that the conversation was actually between jesus and the man, and not the demons themselves. The story does not read that way and the claim is unsupported. If this Miller guy has a magic decoder ring for the bible he should share it with the rest of us.
Furthermore that sermon did not answer any of the questions I had enumerated.
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