(December 30, 2013 at 3:15 pm)missluckie26 Wrote: (...)all we got was LPs say on how the mods felt, (...)

I didn't transmit what the mods felt Luckie, only me. I see now that people might have thought I was being dismissive of the privacy violation and since I am a mod, it could be taken as an official position. It wasn't, and I should've just stayed away from this thread.

(December 30, 2013 at 12:04 pm)missluckie26 Wrote: I'd expect more from a mod. Jacob didn't do anything wrong, and you call his highly legitimate concerns 'whining'. This entire situation is bullshit. Rayaan's conduct has been inappropriate. If that's what satisfies as an apology nowadays, well then Jacob has every right to leave and it isn't his fault at all. Its your job to ensure the comfortability of all members, religious or not, and really that's all the guy wants. To not be online stalked for no reason whatsoever. He just wants Rayaan to say, yeah I went too far, it wont happen again. Honestly, I can't imagine why this is so difficult and I'm a little disconcerted with how the other mods seem to be silent on the issue, or victim blaming. God forbid I have any issue with one of you, I'll just get told to stop whining and not let the door hit me on the way out, apparently.

I've already sent him an earnest apology, which you guys haven't read anything of.

I even explained in great detail why searched him and how, but I've edited out those parts because its too long and it would be sot of tedious for members to read all that stuff.

This was one of my PMs to Jacob:

Rayaan Wrote:Jacob,

I considerately thought about what I said about you in the Hall of Shame thread. And I discussed this recent incident with the other staff members. I was thinking about this tonight also. So, now I'm going to tell you exactly why I wanted to search you, and how I did that.

But, before I go on to explain that, I just want to tell you that I do not feel that I am perfectly justified in what I did anymore. I honestly feel a little bad about the whole thing now. The way that I raised the issue and worded my post in that thread (especially when I said "I know who you are") conveys a level of personal implication much greater than I initially thought it would. It gave the impression as if know a lot about you, which I understand came across rather showy and derisive. So, then you challenged me to go on an impress you. After I did that, you then disclosed all the PM details to the general members and then created a huge commotion about this, which I didn't like. But again, as I admitted, my first response in that thread was inappropriate, and I apologize for that.

I will try not to make this mistake again, and I won't expose anything about you in this forum which you posted elsewhere unless it becomes necessary. So, I hope that you don't feel creeped out by this anymore. And I hope that you're still able to have fun in this place as you were having before. You really don't have to get so upset and leave this forum just because of this incident. It was only my mistake. I hope that you stay with us, but again, no pressure Jacob. It's all up to you.



[Snipped because of a lengthy explanation of the how and why I looked him up outside the forum.]



To be honest, I enjoyed the debates we've had so far, even though I've expressed my suspicions of your beliefs and your motivations several times in this forum. I called you things like disingenuous, hypocrite, double-speaker, munafiq, etc., but you know that those are just my inferences. Even though I said those things, I do realize that I might be wrong about all these claims. There were just my personal evaluation of the things you posted here.

However, perhaps I mistook you for someone who is in his early stages of deconverting, or just having some trouble in letting go with both hands. I hope that you are able to ignore or get over any of the suspicions of mine towards you that you believe is untrue. I still might make criticisms of your posts every now and then (depending on your comments, threads, and all that), but I will try my best to be as gentle as possible, and I will think more carefully before I post something.

I'm sorry for handling this one a little poorly, Jacob. I hope you will understand why I made these choices and how I feel about them now.

- Rayaan

And he replied:

Jacob{smooth) Wrote:Well that's a kind of apology I suppose

[Snipped other comments]

That's all I'm going to say for now. There is obviously more behind this but I'll save that for later.

I know LP, that's just how it all seemed at the time though. Especially since your post was the first wink of anything from mod land since Tiberius posted. I honestly thought that was it!
I am not upset at you, if that's your opinion that's fine.. we all have em. If that was the general mod consensus... Well, you saw how I reacted.

I still love ya's.

(December 30, 2013 at 2:46 pm)Jacob(smooth) Wrote:

Quote: The only decision that has been to date is that Rayaan was wrong to do what he did, and they he owed Jacob an apology. 

The matter is still open.

Then my apologies. I thought that Rayaan s pm s to me were the resolution as it was all I'd heard.

And for the record, Rayaan didn't say it was "just the beginning" he said it was "the first step". Apparently that's not so bad.

And yes I reserve the right to lurk.

If you're still lurking I think your response through all of this has been exemplary. In your shoes, when I felt wronged by an unreasonable mod, I was paranoid enough to seek death by banning. I didn't trust there would be fair resolution and anticipating the gloating and rudeness that I might be subject to once banned, I preemptively rewrote my bio information to express my displeasure. You've handled this better than I did.

Oh, and for the record, I've taken Last Poet off my dead list.

And now he's sharing PM content, ostensibly without permission.


I tried to warn you guys that you needed procedures in place for this kind of scenario. Meh. "I get no respect."

(December 30, 2013 at 2:54 pm)Fidel_Castronaut Wrote: I just hope there is no long lasting damage and that Jacob reconsiders leaving as I think he brings a lot to the table regardless of whether people agree with him or not.

I agree. His counsel has done much to save my soles.

Jack Nicholson and his words of wisdom

Rayaan, it's good you have stepped up to apologize, but to be frank I think your staff privileges should be revoked as we have no way of knowing if have done this to others or that you won't do it again

Forums can fail or succeed by their moderators. Bad boards are run for the benefit of moderators who are allowed to break any rules themselves and use their position to bully and humiliate people.

Good mods PM people, Bad mods like to hold public tellings off. Good mods don't post opinions and then use their mod hat to silence opponents.

I have no been here long enough to tell which way this will go. I haven't seen much bad conduct BUT the conduct I really don't like is not Rayaans action ,which is creepy but he has apologised' my real objection is people who mock the utterly correct conduct of bringing our attention to it. It is not "whining'.

This sort of pack attack is bad enough with normal members. With moderators it is especially bad.

(December 30, 2013 at 3:56 pm)là bạn điên Wrote: .. the conduct I really don't like is not Rayaans action ,which is creepy but he has apologised' my real objection is people who mock the utterly correct conduct of bringing our attention to it. It is not "whining'.

This sort of pack attack is bad enough with normal members. With moderators it is especially bad.

I agree. But Last Poet has apologized for that comment. I think he understands that what he said was dismissive in a pretty ugly way even if all he meant to do was discourage the ongoing discussion about this. Power is insidious and onerous. The mods and admins on this site really do a good job of handling it for the most part. I don't envy them the task but I do appreciate their efforts and good intentions. We've got to remember that taking up the responsibility of being a mod doesn't allow one to set aside their foibles as a human being. The lime light just makes them planer to see. Tip of the hat to you all, staff.