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(December 30, 2013 at 3:51 pm)Lemonvariable72 Wrote: Rayaan, it's good you have stepped up to apologize, but to be frank I think your staff privileges should be revoked as we have no way of knowing if have done this to others or that you won't do it again
Just so. Apology is not relevant whether graceful and well intentioned or tardy and grudging. I'm not required to like rayaan, nor he me. This is pragmatism, not pique.
All I asked him was whether he was done "investigating" me outside of this forum. He said that he could not guarantee that he was. Thus, if I have to post here knowing that if he feels like it (for no better reason than "just in case") he will go "investigating" again, It ruins the fun of posting. We talk about stalking in a jokey way, its actually not a nice feeling.
Worth remembering too that we are not talking about invading privacy for national security, its a fucking discussion forum. For fun.
All I'm asking is an indication that the mod team in general, and rayaan in particular, having established that I'm a real live person, leave my life outside this forum the fuck alone. I'm not asking for immunity from the rules, just that they are applied only to what I write here.
If I can get that I'll be delighted to stay. I don't want to leave cos I like it here. If I can't get that, I can't stay. Very simple.
I'm not asking rayaan to apologise (although it is not inappropriate) nor for him to lose mod priviledges (although that might be too). I just want him to moderate and administrate my posts on AF, and ONLY my posts on AF, and not go digging elsewhere. That was what I asked him, mod had on, for. That he told me I could not have.
As to doing this on open forum, I kinda think it affects everyone because I'm obviously not the only one who has a problem with this. There is a saying an atheist once used on my in relation to religion. "anything which can be killed with the truth... should be". I would suggest having discovered something a bit shadowy that openness and transparency is called for.
"Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken."
Sith code
December 30, 2013 at 4:16 pm (This post was last modified: December 30, 2013 at 4:16 pm by NoraBrimstone.)
(December 30, 2013 at 3:51 pm)Lemonvariable72 Wrote: Rayaan, it's good you have stepped up to apologize, but to be frank I think your staff privileges should be revoked as we have no way of knowing if have done this to others or that you won't do it again
I agree with this. I'm not particularly comfortable here knowing there's a serious stalker on the staff.
December 30, 2013 at 4:17 pm (This post was last modified: December 30, 2013 at 4:22 pm by LastPoet.)
(December 30, 2013 at 4:05 pm)whateverist Wrote: I agree. But Last Poet has apologized for that comment. I think he understands that what he said was dismissive in a pretty ugly way even if all he meant to do was discourage the ongoing discussion about this. Power is insidious and onerous. The mods and admins on this site really do a good job of handling it for the most part. I don't envy them the task but I do appreciate their efforts and good intentions. We've got to remember that taking up the responsibility of being a mod doesn't allow one to set aside their foibles as a human being. The lime light just makes them planer to see. Tip of the hat to you all, staff.
Tiberius had already asked the parts to refrain from commenting on the matter, that we were seriously looking into it, Then Jacob brought it up again, when we didn't made any deliberation. My bad use of 'whining' was sheer dumbness by my part, as it seemed to 1-Dismissive of legitimate concerns; 2- Since I am a mod, people might take my posts as official positions.
(December 30, 2013 at 4:13 pm)Jacob(smooth) Wrote:
(December 30, 2013 at 3:51 pm)Lemonvariable72 Wrote: Rayaan, it's good you have stepped up to apologize, but to be frank I think your staff privileges should be revoked as we have no way of knowing if have done this to others or that you won't do it again
Just so. Apology is not relevant whether graceful and well intentioned or tardy and grudging. I'm not required to like rayaan, nor he me. This is pragmatism, not pique.
All I asked him was whether he was done "investigating" me outside of this forum. He said that he could not guarantee that he was. Thus, if I have to post here knowing that if he feels like it (for no better reason than "just in case") he will go "investigating" again, It ruins the fun of posting. We talk about stalking in a jokey way, its actually not a nice feeling.
Worth remembering too that we are not talking about invading privacy for national security, its a fucking discussion forum. For fun.
All I'm asking is an indication that the mod team in general, and rayaan in particular, having established that I'm a real live person, leave my life outside this forum the fuck alone. I'm not asking for immunity from the rules, just that they are applied only to what I write here.
If I can get that I'll be delighted to stay. I don't want to leave cos I like it here. If I can't get that, I can't stay. Very simple.
I'm not asking rayaan to apologise (although it is not inappropriate) nor for him to lose mod priviledges (although that might be too). I just want him to moderate and administrate my posts on AF, and ONLY my posts on AF, and not go digging elsewhere. That was what I asked him, mod had on, for. That he told me I could not have.
As to doing this on open forum, I kinda think it affects everyone because I'm obviously not the only one who has a problem with this. There is a saying an atheist once used on my in relation to religion. "anything which can be killed with the truth... should be". I would suggest having discovered something a bit shadowy that openness and transparency is called for.
Jacob I agree with you and from what I have seen here you have been more then fair and patient. However we can't trust him now. We have no way of knowing if he has done this to others, and he has access to donor finianicial records too.
To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
(December 30, 2013 at 4:20 pm)Lemonvariable72 Wrote: he has access to donor finianicial records too.
How about we stick with what is factual here? He does not.
Donations are done via PayPal, to Tiberius' account. The only information that is disclosed to Tiberius is the email address associated to the donor's PayPal account. Unless Tiberius has shared the login credentials to his PayPal account, no other staff member has any visibility whatsoever into such information - and again, it is ONLY the donor's PayPal email address.
(December 30, 2013 at 4:17 pm)LastPoet Wrote: Tiberius had already asked the parts to refrain from commenting on the matter, that we were seriously looking into it, Then Jacob brought it up again, when we didn't made any deliberation. My bad use of 'whining' was sheer dumbness by my part, as it seemed to 1-Dismissive of legitimate concerns; 2- Since I am a mod, people might take my posts as official positions.
Sometimes I'm an ass like that.
As noted, we all make mistakes. I applaud your humility and stepping up and taking responsibility for your actions.
(December 30, 2013 at 4:30 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote:
(December 30, 2013 at 4:20 pm)Lemonvariable72 Wrote: he has access to donor finianicial records too.
How about we stick with what is factual here? He does not.
Donations are done via PayPal, to Tiberius' account. The only information that is disclosed to Tiberius is the email address associated to the donor's PayPal account. Unless Tiberius has shared the login credentials to his PayPal account, no other staff member has any visibility whatsoever into such information - and again, it is ONLY the donor's PayPal email address.
My apologies then.
To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
RE: Privacy concerns from [split] AF Hall of Shame (Post Edition)
December 31, 2013 at 12:07 am
(December 30, 2013 at 4:13 pm)Jacob(smooth) Wrote: All I asked him was whether he was done "investigating" me outside of this forum. He said that he could not guarantee that he was. Thus, if I have to post here knowing that if he feels like it (for no better reason than "just in case") he will go "investigating" again, It ruins the fun of posting. We talk about stalking in a jokey way, its actually not a nice feeling.
Worth remembering too that we are not talking about invading privacy for national security, its a fucking discussion forum. For fun.
Jacob, just a few things I'm going to say to you briefly.
1. You asked me "Are you now done 'investigating' me?" My reply to that was, basically, that I cannot promise you that I won't ever investigate you. Why did I say that? It's because sometimes the staff team will and does investigate members, and we are allowed to do that for internal staff reasons. You will not get an immunity from this rule either. I'm sorry if you don't like it, though. To be honest, it's a bit funny to me that it takes this little to ruin the fun for you.
Privacy Policy Wrote:It takes a lot of work to keep our site running and prevent abuse, and we sometimes use your data in order to facilitate this. Your information is used internally only where necessary. For instance, we keep IP addresses of all traffic for 90 days in order to investigate issues with our site, track and block suspected spammers, and otherwise maintain the integrity of the community. We keep post and shout IP data indefinitely due to limitations with the MyBB software, and because it makes it easier for us to identify sock accounts.
2. In this case, however, I'll admit that it was not actually necessary to search you outside of this forum, but I did have some suspicions of you and that's why searched you in other forums/websites. This is also valid reason to search members. I did this for an internal staff reason, and it was also because I was curious to see whether or not my suspicions of you were correct.
3. I had suspicions of you for a reason, which doesn't need to be discussed in the public arena at this time although the staff is aware of my reasons (and they even agreed that I had an acceptable reason to search/investigate you outside of this forum). I have proof of all of this in a report thread, which I and the staff members have been discussing.
4. That being said, what I did somewhat violate, and I apologized for doing so, is the following rule:
Privacy Policy Wrote:We may disclose – or preserve for future disclosure – your information if we believe, after due consideration, that doing so is reasonably necessary to comply with a law, regulation, or legal request. If we are going to release your information, we will do our best to provide you with notice in advance via the private messaging system unless we are prohibited by court order from doing so.
^ That was the worst thing I did. I flaunted the knowledge that I obtained of you in a rather careless and immature manner. I should have at least told you that privately instead of doing it in the open forum. And I admit it was a bit of a 'power trip' on my side, along with my use of words like "skillz" and "Muslim stalker" and similar words. I apologized to you for behaving that way. And once again, I'm sorry about that.
And still, I didn't intend to convey too much seriousness nor offensiveness in my first couple of posts in this thread, and that's why used all those tongue and winking emoticons at the end of my sentences. I don't really use those emoticons when I'm being totally serious with a member or when I put my "mod hat" on. Unfortunately, I think you took it a little too seriously and you turned into a huge commotion after I PMed you.
5. Did I really reveal too much about you in that first post? No.
All I said was something vague: "I read your posts in X forum and I know who are. " <--- (which, again, was a mistake), but I didn't disclose any personal information about you out in the open. I only PMed you a link to a thread that contains a picture of you and your family (which is already public) and two other pieces of information, when you told me "go on and impress me," in the second post in this thread. But none of the other members saw that except you.
Also, you already told us that you are podiatrist, so I didn't think that you would react in such a way just because I said that I saw you in a podiatrist forum and "I know who you are." Those comments were inappropriate, and I apologized for doing that, but I didn't actually post any sort of personal information or details about you in the public arena ... no personal photos, telephone numbers, youtube videos ... nothing.
But, at least I learned a lesson from this and hopefully you (and everyone else) learned something too. We all made mistakes and mistakes are bound to happen.
I hope that you will reconsider and stay, but if you don't want to, then again, no pressure.
RE: Privacy concerns from [split] AF Hall of Shame (Post Edition)
December 31, 2013 at 12:25 am
(December 31, 2013 at 12:07 am)Rayaan Wrote:
(December 30, 2013 at 4:13 pm)Jacob(smooth) Wrote: All I asked him was whether he was done "investigating" me outside of this forum. He said that he could not guarantee that he was. Thus, if I have to post here knowing that if he feels like it (for no better reason than "just in case") he will go "investigating" again, It ruins the fun of posting. We talk about stalking in a jokey way, its actually not a nice feeling.
Worth remembering too that we are not talking about invading privacy for national security, its a fucking discussion forum. For fun.
Jacob, just a few things I'm going to say to you briefly.
1. You asked me "Are you now done 'investigating' me?" My reply to that was, basically, that I cannot promise you that I won't ever investigate you. Why did I say that? It's because sometimes the staff team will and does investigate members, and we are allowed to do that for internal staff reasons. You will not get an immunity from this rule either. I'm sorry if you don't like it, though. To be honest, it's a bit funny to me that it takes this little to ruin the fun for you.
Privacy Policy Wrote:It takes a lot of work to keep our site running and prevent abuse, and we sometimes use your data in order to facilitate this. Your information is used internally only where necessary. For instance, we keep IP addresses of all traffic for 90 days in order to investigate issues with our site, track and block suspected spammers, and otherwise maintain the integrity of the community. We keep post and shout IP data indefinitely due to limitations with the MyBB software, and because it makes it easier for us to identify sock accounts.
2. In this case, however, I'll admit that it was not actually necessary to search you outside of this forum, but I did have some suspicions of you and that's why searched you in other forums/websites. This is also valid reason to search members. I did this for an internal staff reason, and it was also because I was curious to see whether or not my suspicions of you were correct.
3. I had suspicions of you for a reason, which doesn't need to be discussed in the public arena at this time although the staff is aware of my reasons (and they even agreed that I had an acceptable reason to search/investigate you outside of this forum). I have proof of all of this in a report thread, which I and the staff members have been discussing.
4. That being said, what I did somewhat violate, and I apologized for doing so, is the following rule:
Privacy Policy Wrote:We may disclose – or preserve for future disclosure – your information if we believe, after due consideration, that doing so is reasonably necessary to comply with a law, regulation, or legal request. If we are going to release your information, we will do our best to provide you with notice in advance via the private messaging system unless we are prohibited by court order from doing so.
^ That was the worst thing I did. I flaunted the knowledge that I obtained of you in a rather careless and immature manner. I should have at least told you that privately instead of doing it in the open forum. And I admit it was a bit of a 'power trip' on my side, along with my use of words like "skillz" and "Muslim stalker" and similar words. I apologized to you for behaving that way. And once again, I'm sorry about that.
And still, I didn't intend to convey too much seriousness nor offensiveness in my first couple of posts in this thread, and that's why used all those tongue and winking emoticons at the end of my sentences. I don't really use those emoticons when I'm being totally serious with a member or when I put my "mod hat" on. Unfortunately, I think you took it a little too seriously and you turned into a huge commotion after I PMed you.
5. Did I really reveal too much about you in that first post? No.
All I said was something vague: "I read your posts in X forum and I know who are. " <--- (which, again, was a mistake), but I didn't disclose any personal information about you out in the open. I only PMed you a link to a thread that contains a picture of you and your family (which is already public) and two other pieces of information, when you told me "go on and impress me," in the second post in this thread. But none of the other members saw that except you.
Also, you already told us that you are podiatrist, so I didn't think that you would react in such a way just because I said that I saw you in a podiatrist forum and "I know who you are." Those comments were inappropriate, and I apologized for doing that, but I didn't actually post any sort of personal information or details about you in the public arena ... no personal photos, telephone numbers, youtube videos ... nothing.
But, at least I learned a lesson from this and hopefully you (and everyone else) learned something too. We all made mistakes and mistakes are bound to happen.
I hope that you will reconsider and stay, but if you don't want to, then again, no pressure.
- Rayaan
I respect you Rayaan. This, however, is lame. There are many members who, not only want you to apologize, want you to step down from admin duties because what you did was wrong. Your apologies, at least the public ones, have been half-assed at best. You're not really apologizing for anything, but yet justifying your actions as if they were right, which I think most of us agree, they weren't. You were in the wrong, and you have yet to take actual, real responsibility for that.
I've pretty much kept my mouth shut through all of this, but damn. I don't think I can sit here and let it happen this way without putting in a harsh 2 cents.
![[Image: extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg]](https://i.postimg.cc/zf86M5L7/extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg)
" <--- (which, again, was a mistake), but I didn't disclose any personal information about you out in the open. I only PMed you a link to a thread that contains a picture of you and your family (which is already public) and two other pieces of information, when you told me "go on and impress me," in the second post in this thread. But none of the other members saw that except you.
