Hi

When I think of people that are really good people, I have sense they are nearer to God then others. I also feel we can move closer to God. I feel there is stages and that these stages are real, that we really move closer or further from God by how our hearts of souls move through out lives influenced by how we act and react.

Taking away God, what do Atheists feel they gravitate towards? Goodness has no metaphysical existence to draw closer to from an Atheistic perspective, so while we may become more good, we are not moving closer to anything really or am I missing something?

Do you still feel there is stages of higher and lower if we take God out of the picture?

What?

Are you saying without your particular baby-murdering rape-endorsing deity people cannot distinguish good from evil, and cannot work toward maximizing good?

If we reverse the argument, how has religion made you a better person?

Do you find you care more about other people than you did without religion?

Do you actively do more to help other people, or do you believe care and prayer are sufficient?

The idea that any god is good is debatable, as with everything else, and good and evil are pretty subjective things. Doing good doesn't necessarily bring us closer to whichever god you're talking about, so much as obeying them. Of course that deity surely thinks that whatever it wants is good by default, but that's not a given.

I suppose if we're moving closer to anything in a metaphorical sense, we'd be moving close to each other, or an ideal society, by attempting to do good. Enlightenment could be a word for it.

(April 20, 2014 at 6:19 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Hi

When I think of people that are really good people, I have sense they are nearer to God then others. I also feel we can move closer to God. I feel there is stages and that these stages are real, that we really move closer or further from God by how our hearts of souls move through out lives influenced by how we act and react.

Taking away God, what do Atheists feel they gravitate towards? Goodness has no metaphysical existence to draw closer to from an Atheistic perspective, so while we may become more good, we are not moving closer to anything really or am I missing something?

Do you still feel there is stages of higher and lower if we take God out of the picture?

I don't think these questions are meaningful. Other than goodness for its own sake, why should atheists gravitate toward anything at all?

In fact, with God out of the picture, I should think people would find it much simpler to achieve levels of 'goodness' more sympatico with a general greater good. As Jim Jeffries puts it, 'Try not to be a cunt.'

Boru

Quote:Taking away God, what do Atheists feel they gravitate towards?

Sanity.

(April 20, 2014 at 6:19 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Hi

When I think of people that are really good people, I have sense they are nearer to God then others. I also feel we can move closer to God. I feel there is stages and that these stages are real, that we really move closer or further from God by how our hearts of souls move through out lives influenced by how we act and react.

Taking away God, what do Atheists feel they gravitate towards? Goodness has no metaphysical existence to draw closer to from an Atheistic perspective, so while we may become more good, we are not moving closer to anything really or am I missing something?

Do you still feel there is stages of higher and lower if we take God out of the picture?

like being under water and asking are you wet? or wetter?

of whos closer ... you or me. Its a silly notion.
we are all same "closness'

What am I talking about is stages. Do you believe being more good will gravitate you towards a higher reality? I don't think this is possible from an Atheistic point of view. Therefore this notion of one being higher or lower seems to non-sense from an Atheistic stand point. So it can be said higher and lower is a proof of the Highest One to whom is a reality by which the other stages get their reality.

I might be missing something here. This is why I'm asking.

No.


More to the point, there is no evidence of any "higher reality."

(April 20, 2014 at 7:21 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: What am I talking about is stages. Do you believe being more good will gravitate you towards a higher reality? I don't think this is possible from an Atheistic point of view. Therefore this notion of one being higher or lower seems to non-sense from an Atheistic stand point. So it can be said higher and lower is a proof of the Highest One to whom is a reality by which the other stages get their reality.

I might be missing something here. This is why I'm asking.

self awareness is the key. Religion can help that threw a set of rituals.

Not everybody needs it tho. And god, if there is one, only wants you to be your best you, you can be.

Religious people don't do anything good to be closer to god, they do it for themselves.
Just like Atheists. It's evolution.
Don't throw rocks at others because it may harm your chances of survival.
God doesn't need to be in the equation.
On top of that, if there is any such thing as free will, there's not much room to move between your personality, environment and history.
Personally, I think most people are as good as they can be.
I think you should reexamine your idea of being closer to god. It's really, who does god love the most, isn't it?
Sibling rivalry, daddy loves me more than you because I'm better behaved.