(May 27, 2014 at 9:49 am)RobbyPants Wrote:

(May 24, 2014 at 9:52 pm)topher Wrote: Heliocentrism has been demonstrated beyond any shadow of a doubt, and even Christians accept this as fact.

It's a bit of a nitpick, but most Christians accept it. I have run into a few on a Christian forum that still believe in geocentrism. To get there, they also have to categorically reject gravity. Yeah, it's pretty weird.

Other than that, I do agree with your OP. The idea that all of this exists just for us is selfish and vain.

Yeah, NephilimFree on YouTube is a literal geocentrist, and there have been some books on the subject by Christians claiming to be scientists. I put geocentrism on the same shelf as the flat-earth hypothesis, the expanding earth hypothesis, and the hollow-earth hypothesis.

It's a dead idea, regardless of a few lingering supporters here and there.

Thanks for the good words, man.

yep.

"I decide for myself and nobody but me picks my path" aint geocentric. It's just self centered.

I point to the above's sig.

Perhaps human scale is the log center between the cosmically large and the smallest of scales.

Well, you could have simply said "Religion is Geocentrism".
However until we truly know that there is another sapient race out there in the universe, we can only say as much.

Are humans really intelligent?

(May 27, 2014 at 8:18 am)Ksa Wrote:

(May 25, 2014 at 4:14 pm)Lek Wrote: Yes he created man in his image and to rule over the earth and created him lower than the angels. Psalm 8:4-5
4 what is mankind that you are mindful of them,
human beings that you care for them?[a]
5 You have made them[b] a little lower than the angels[c]
and crowned them[d] with glory and honor.
I don't know about the quran, but the bible never mentions that mankind was the greatest creation in the universe or was to rule over the entire universe.

Ok but what is the context of that? If I say humans are lower than the birds, does it mean inferior? No, it means beneath them. The birds fly in the sky and the humans walk the earth beneath. It points out to a geographical location and not a rank lol.

Lek has taken you apart here, why, because you believe you know more about the scriptures than well studied Christians. You come up with something so stupid that it's no more than a joke. You ran out on our conversation when I brought the scriptures that showed you are a pretender. Why don't you stop while you're behind, because you will find yourself falling farther behind.

GC

(May 24, 2014 at 9:52 pm)topher Wrote: This is a point I recently raised with a Christian friend of mine. Potential rambling ahead, beware.

Before Galileo and Copernicus helped to destroy the geocentric model of the universe, it was almost universally accepted amongst all religious people, with Christians in particular. The reason is, no doubt, that it fits the best with the religious text, and if one accepts the Bible as fact, then geocentrism pretty much logically follows. After all, if an all-powerful, all-knowing, intelligent super-being created the Earth from nothing, with the intention of placing his most cherished creation upon it, it seems odd that he would NOT make it the center of the universe.

Of course, we know this is indeed not the case, the Earth is not the center of much of anything, as far as we can tell. Heliocentrism has been demonstrated beyond any shadow of a doubt, and even Christians accept this as fact. The more we discover about the universe, the more insignificant the Earth becomes. Each time we expand our cosmological horizon, the Bible makes less and less sense. (Except for Louie Giglio, who somehow believes the vastness of the universe actually proves God's existence. http://atheistforums.org/images/smilies/huh2.gif)

So why does the fact that there are hundreds of billions of galaxies, each containing hundreds of billions of stars, not raise a red flag for Christians? If the Lord is truly capable of anything, why not create the most simple design possible? Why fill the universe with an unimaginable number of worlds that humanity will never, ever explore? And, more importantly, what could be better proof for skeptics than the Earth being clearly created as the most important place in existence?

But, this will not faze a true believer, I've found. They are convinced that, while the Earth may not be the cosmological center of the universe, it is the spiritual center of the universe, and it is the only planet that God really even cares about.

This IS geocentrism. And it's as ridiculous to me as any "special snowflake" philosophy out there. So I went ahead and crunched a few numbers. Keep in mind, these are very rough estimates, and I was being pretty generous, keeping the numbers on the lower end of the scale.



Take the estimated number of planets in an average galaxy: 1,000,000,000,000 or 10^12.

Take the estimated number of galaxies in the observable universe: 150,000,000,000 or 1.5x10^11.

Therefore, the estimated number of planets in the observable universe roughly equals: 150,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 or 1.5x10^23. "One-hundred fifty sextillion" (!)

(To put that into perspective, the number of seconds that have passed since the Big Bang is roughly: 432,339,120,000,000,000 or 4.3233912 x 10^17. 1.5x10^23 is more than 375,000 times larger than 4.32x10^17.)

Therefore, the Earth represents 0.00000000000000000000000667% of the planets in our observable universe.

If one accepts a spiritually geocentric universe, then God ignores 99.99999999999999999999999333% of all planets in that universe.



Well, I hope this gets a discussion going on the subject. Christianity IS geocentrism, and nothing less. Hope you guys enjoyed the read.

Why can't God do as He wishes? What law is there that forces God have to place earth at the center of His universe. What if He means that the earth is the center of His universe because He has chose place His focus on His creation on this particular planet? If he chose another planet in another galaxy then so be it, but He chose earth for whatever reason. He will be showing His followers throughout eternity the riches of His grace. Who is to say that He will share the rest of His creation with His family through eternity to come? I dunno.

(May 27, 2014 at 11:14 pm)Godschild Wrote:

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(May 27, 2014 at 8:18 am)Ksa Wrote: Ok but what is the context of that? If I say humans are lower than the birds, does it mean inferior? No, it means beneath them. The birds fly in the sky and the humans walk the earth beneath. It points out to a geographical location and not a rank lol.

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Lek has taken you apart here, why, because you believe you know more about the scriptures than well studied Christians. You come up with something so stupid that it's no more than a joke. You ran out on our conversation when I brought the scriptures that showed you are a pretender. Why don't you stop while you're behind, because you will find yourself falling farther behind.

GC

Baghdad Bob could have learned a lot from you.

(May 27, 2014 at 11:14 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(May 27, 2014 at 8:18 am)Ksa Wrote: Ok but what is the context of that? If I say humans are lower than the birds, does it mean inferior? No, it means beneath them. The birds fly in the sky and the humans walk the earth beneath. It points out to a geographical location and not a rank lol.

Lek has taken you apart here, why, because you believe you know more about the scriptures than well studied Christians. You come up with something so stupid that it's no more than a joke. You ran out on our conversation when I brought the scriptures that showed you are a pretender. Why don't you stop while you're behind, because you will find yourself falling farther behind.

GC

If the angels were superior, then why did God bother creating Adam and Eve that are, according to you, inferior beings, after he created the angels. Did God get dumber and could no longer do better? Unless, he created superior beings! If the angels were superior, why not stick to making angels?

In case you got a nut missing I'll give you an analogy: Honda makes the 2014 model, imagine, in 2018, honda takes the 2004 model and labels it as the 2018 model. Will anyone buy it? It is you who are the pretender.

(May 28, 2014 at 9:48 am)Ksa Wrote: In case you got a nut missing I'll give you an analogy: Honda makes the 2014 model, imagine, in 2018, honda takes the 2004 model and labels it as the 2018 model. Will anyone buy it? It is you who are the pretender.

That'a a pretty silly analogy. That's like saying that since we've made cars, we shouldn't make bicycles anymore.