"Straight to genocide?!! What happened to two verbal and one written warning? Calm the fuck down man, let's talk about this!" Lol

http://youtu.be/h6omFJhKr6o

(March 3, 2015 at 4:28 pm)robvalue Wrote: Original sin is all about being "bad" for just being born, for being related to sinners. What else is it? Do you not believe this now? It would be great if you don't because it's a repulsive concept.

Immorality is a real thing, yes. Sin is not.

No. It's about being born with a propensity to sin. Otherwise, those who died as infants would end up in hell.

Right. So he makes us that way, giving us this propensity, knowing it's going to cause us to sin. The he gets all mad because we sin. Which is nothing to do with being immoral, it's to do with things he doesn't like us doing. But which he designed us to do. Couldn't he just, not do that? Make us good, and give us free will to choose between good things instead of setting us all up to fail? Why should we be responsible for what our distant ancestors did?

He deliberately makes us sinners, makes us hate ourselves, so he can swoop in with the cure. Scam much?

Why must he behave in this blatantly evil fashion to keep us dependent on him?

I feel like of all the theists on the board at the moment, you're the one with the most chance of breaking free from all this. I can't tell you how good it's going to feel if you make it that far. I know that may seem impossible now, but just see where it all goes.

I get the distinct feeling that part of your brain knows how ludicrous all of this is, and is tired of having to come up with rationalizations to make it seem plausible and to excuse the behaviour of this tyrant. But another part of your brain is shit scared in case it is in fact real, and the consequences of letting go. It's this fear which has kept religion going so long.

(March 3, 2015 at 5:27 pm)Parkers Tan Wrote: Genesis 3:19 makes it pretty clear that death was given to humans for the "sin" of eating an apple.

The bible doesn't say that they ate an apple. It says that they ate of the fruit of the tree. "Fruit" has more meanings than just something that is harvested from a literal tree and consumed. Fruit can refer to the effect of something. Their sin was disobeying God.

(March 4, 2015 at 12:35 pm)Lek Wrote:

(March 3, 2015 at 4:28 pm)robvalue Wrote: Original sin is all about being "bad" for just being born, for being related to sinners. What else is it? Do you not believe this now? It would be great if you don't because it's a repulsive concept.

Immorality is a real thing, yes. Sin is not.

No. It's about being born with a propensity to sin. Otherwise, those who died as infants would end up in hell.

So all infants that die go to heaven?

(March 4, 2015 at 12:40 pm)robvalue Wrote: Right. So he makes us that way, giving us this propensity, knowing it's going to cause us to sin. The he gets all mad because we sin. Which is nothing to do with being immoral, it's to do with things he doesn't like us doing. But which he designed us to do. Couldn't he just, not do that? Make us good, and give us free will to choose between good things instead of setting us all up to fail? Why should we be responsible for what our distant ancestors did?

He deliberately makes us sinners, makes us hate ourselves, so he can swoop in with the cure. Scam much?

He could have just not done that, but he did do it that way. We do have a propensity to sin, but he also gave us the sure way to overcome it, through Jesus Christ. I don't know why he did it that way. He is the omniscient one, not me.

Yeah. He broke your legs and sold you a crutch. The thing is, he didn't do either of those things. God and Jesus have never done any of this. All you have is people telling you all this stuff has gone on, and is going on. How do they know? Because people told them. And so on. It's a long standing oral myth, nothing more. Again, part of your brain knows this I'm sure.

If god was all powerful and all good, he wouldn't put us through this shit. He could achieve whatever whacked out plan he is while actually making us happy. If he can't, he's not all powerful. If he won't, he's not all good.

(March 4, 2015 at 12:41 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: So all infants that die go to heaven?

That's my assumption. I don't know for sure. They don't don't possess the capacity to make a choice to sin or to reject God.

(March 4, 2015 at 12:49 pm)Lek Wrote:

(March 4, 2015 at 12:41 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: So all infants that die go to heaven?

That's my assumption. I don't know for sure. They don't don't possess the capacity to make a choice to sin or to reject God.

And what about other people that have never heard of the Christian god or Jesus?

(March 4, 2015 at 12:49 pm)robvalue Wrote: Yeah. He broke your legs and sold you a crutch. The thing is, he didn't do either of those things. God and Jesus have never done any of this. All you have is people telling you all this stuff has gone on, and is going on. How do they know? Because people told then. And so on. It's a long standing oral myth, nothing more. Again, part of your brain knows this I'm sure.

If you want to disregard the writings and attestations of those who lived at the time and knew him, then you can say that it didn't happen. I choose to believe it.