1 if god exists he is all loving, all powerful, all knowing, and is good
2 if god exists he has 'given' us free will to freely choose to perform morally good or evil acts
3 if god exists he is the creator and sustainer of all life
4 if god exists those who commit morally evil acts will be tortured forever in hell
5 psychopaths exist and there nature is determined by a strong genetic component (they are created that way) and do morally evil acts because of their nature (they are compelled and cannot choose to stop their actions)
6 therefore, god created creatures who cannot choose by free will to perform morally good acts on all occasions. They are necessarily evil
7 therefore god with foreknowledge has created creatures that are doomed to be tortured forever and this is not the act of an all loving being, but the act of a capricious and uncaring being
8 therefore god does not exist

Quote:therefore god does not exist

Or....he DOES exist and is just a prick.


I'm more inclined to say "does not exist" but logic can serve many masters.

Do you actually believe these are logically valid arguments, or do you just post them to make rational people laugh?

(August 24, 2010 at 4:15 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:therefore god does not exist

Or....he DOES exist and is just a prick.
I'm more inclined to say "does not exist" but logic can serve many masters.

(August 24, 2010 at 4:16 pm)Tiberius Wrote: Do you actually believe these are logically valid arguments, or do you just post them to make rational people laugh?

Nihilists just like to destroy everything! As valid as the arguments for god.

(August 24, 2010 at 4:09 pm)Captain Scarlet Wrote: 4 if god exists those who commit morally evil acts will be tortured forever in hell

No, God forgives all those who want to be saved.

I don't believe there exists a person incapable or potentially undeserving of salvation.

Frodo understands.






He can make his invisible friend do whatever he wants him to do.

(August 24, 2010 at 4:16 pm)Tiberius Wrote: Do you actually believe these are logically valid arguments, or do you just post them to make rational people laugh?

To me, the argument seems valid, even if not sound. The problem of evil is a major question in theology, and one that can't be dismissed glibly.

(August 24, 2010 at 6:04 pm)The Omnissiunt One Wrote:

(August 24, 2010 at 4:16 pm)Tiberius Wrote: Do you actually believe these are logically valid arguments, or do you just post them to make rational people laugh?

To me, the argument seems valid, even if not sound. The problem of evil is a major question in theology, and one that can't be dismissed glibly.

The first line states "if god exists he is all loving, all powerful, all knowing, and is good".

That is a non-sequitur right there. It does not follow that God existing means that God is also all-loving, all-powerful, all-knowing, and it good. At best, God existing means God exists.

The other points all have similar fallacies in them. The logic is far from valid, and far from sound.

(August 24, 2010 at 4:09 pm)Captain Scarlet Wrote: 4 if god exists those who commit morally evil acts will be tortured forever in hell

This statement seems to imply that there are those who do not "commit morally evil acts." According to the Bible, "all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of Yahweh." yada yada yada Consequently, one does not go to heaven because they have done "good" things but because they have "faith" in this god. One does not go to hell because they have done "evil" things but because they do not have "faith." One is "saved by faith," not "by works."

I remember all this silliness from almost two decades ago. So when a very kind philanthropist who is an atheist dies, he goes to hell. But THIS ALSO MEANS that Stalin is in hell-- but NOT because of what he did, but because of his lack of faith. If one is not "saved" by works, one is not damned by them either. What one does has no bearing on "going to heaven" or "going to hell." Hence all that business about the two thieves on the cross. Ultimately morality is irrelevant in the Christian scheme of things.

(August 24, 2010 at 6:20 pm)Tiberius Wrote: The first line states "if god exists he is all loving, all powerful, all knowing, and is good".

That is a non-sequitur right there. It does not follow that God existing means that God is also all-loving, all-powerful, all-knowing, and it good. At best, God existing means God exists.

The other points all have similar fallacies in them. The logic is far from valid, and far from sound.

It's certainly ambiguous, but I assume he meant the traditional monotheistic god. The other points are all entailed by a Judeo-Islamo-Christian-nutter viewpoint, but not for all definitions of god, of course. A deist god can't be touched by the problem of evil.