Posts: 7318
Threads: 75
Joined: April 18, 2015
Reputation:
73
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 12:54 pm
(June 25, 2015 at 12:49 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I'm sorry you feel that way, but if my beliefs are offenssive to people, then perhaps they should not ask. I did not give that information off voluntarily. I merely answered a question that was asked directly to me. I can see how upset people get here when I don't answer their questions, or even when I don't answer immediately, so this kind of leaves me in a lose lose situation.
Furthermore, if I had answered the question with "God condemns people," I'd be accused of being disrespectful. I answered with "God has mercy on people," (which is my real answer) and I'm still accused of being disrespectful. Once again, lose lose. It is what it is.
Then don't claim you never said it.
Yes, the beliefs you hold are offensive. I'm not asking you not to voice them. I'm pointing out that you are just as condescending as you accuse other people of being.
Posts: 15452
Threads: 147
Joined: June 15, 2015
Reputation:
88
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 12:59 pm
(June 25, 2015 at 12:44 pm)Alex K Wrote: (June 25, 2015 at 12:12 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: That's fine. I respect your views.
My views have no need for respect. If you think they are wrong, tell me why.
Well I respect them anyway.
And I already told you. I believe God gives us free will and allows nature to take its coarse... and have explained why I believe this.
Perhaps cancer is made worse by all the processed stuff we have freely chosen to put in our food and the pollution/damage we voluntarily do to the environment.
I'm not sure what else to say. Looks like on this we will just have to continue to disagree, and that is perfectly fine.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
Posts: 7140
Threads: 12
Joined: March 14, 2013
Reputation:
72
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 1:02 pm
(June 25, 2015 at 12:59 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I believe God gives us free will and allows nature to take its coarse...
If we gave up our free will and left the decision in god's hands, whether to save us or curse us, which do you think he would choose?
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould
Posts: 15452
Threads: 147
Joined: June 15, 2015
Reputation:
88
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 1:03 pm
(This post was last modified: June 25, 2015 at 1:10 pm by Catholic_Lady.)
(June 25, 2015 at 12:54 pm)Neimenovic Wrote: (June 25, 2015 at 12:49 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I'm sorry you feel that way, but if my beliefs are offenssive to people, then perhaps they should not ask. I did not give that information off voluntarily. I merely answered a question that was asked directly to me. I can see how upset people get here when I don't answer their questions, or even when I don't answer immediately, so this kind of leaves me in a lose lose situation.
Furthermore, if I had answered the question with "God condemns people," I'd be accused of being disrespectful. I answered with "God has mercy on people," (which is my real answer) and I'm still accused of being disrespectful. Once again, lose lose. It is what it is.
Then don't claim you never said it.
Yes, the beliefs you hold are offensive.
I have distinguished the difference between telling an atheist on this forum "God has mercy on you,"
...And honestly answering a question that was directly asked to me in reference to a third party.
I see a big difference between these 2, because the first one I would never do. I'm sorry if you think they are the exact same. But I was not lying in my response to you, I just disagree that they are the same thing.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
Posts: 11260
Threads: 61
Joined: January 5, 2013
Reputation:
123
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 1:03 pm
I think there are certain gods I'd be okay with. I'm reading Kushiel's Dart now, and its central Jesus figure, Elua, would be a good god to know about; his central tenet is "Love as thou wilt," which unambiguously, through his own actions (Elua demonstrably existed in that world and founded a country) rebukes all forms of sexual guilt while turning rape into a heresy and elevating positive forms of love- consent, romance, family, charity- into national pastimes that blessed the country with great prosperity. Elua's disciples are also active members of the pantheon, and perform real miracles that benefit people; a medieval world with no birth control and a divine mandate to love whomever you wish would seem to be a hotbed of unwanted pregnancies and STDs, but no, all the believers there are kept divinely infertile right up until the moment they pray for pregnancy, and then it'll happen.
That's the kind of god I would like; one who thinks things through, who admires humans for their good qualities and elevates them to divine blessings, who actively helps people and keeps heaven open to all, having no need of a hell since he's influenced people to show their better natures all the time.
That's a good god. But it's not any extant, real world religious figure, either.
"YOU take the hard look in the mirror. You are everything that is wrong with this world. The only thing important to you, is you." - ronedee
Want to see more of my writing? Check out my (safe for work!) site, Unprotected Sects!
Posts: 7140
Threads: 12
Joined: March 14, 2013
Reputation:
72
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 1:05 pm
(June 25, 2015 at 1:03 pm)Esquilax Wrote: I think there are certain gods I'd be okay with. I'm reading Kushiel's Dart now, and its central Jesus figure, Elua, would be a good god to know about;
However, his legalistic cousin EULA is a frightful creature indeed.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould
Posts: 15452
Threads: 147
Joined: June 15, 2015
Reputation:
88
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 1:05 pm
(June 25, 2015 at 1:02 pm)Tonus Wrote: (June 25, 2015 at 12:59 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I believe God gives us free will and allows nature to take its coarse...
If we gave up our free will and left the decision in god's hands, whether to save us or curse us, which do you think he would choose?
Save us. :-)
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
Posts: 18510
Threads: 129
Joined: January 19, 2014
Reputation:
91
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 1:06 pm
(This post was last modified: June 25, 2015 at 1:08 pm by Alex K.)
(June 25, 2015 at 12:59 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Perhaps cancer is made worse by all the processed stuff we have freely chosen to put in our food
That's probably it, processed food is the culprit. So your God is off the hook for now, there's nothing he could have done. Whew, that was close.
*bites in keyboard*
The fool hath said in his heart, There is a God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
Psalm 14, KJV revised edition
Posts: 15452
Threads: 147
Joined: June 15, 2015
Reputation:
88
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 1:09 pm
(This post was last modified: June 25, 2015 at 1:12 pm by Catholic_Lady.)
(June 25, 2015 at 12:54 pm)Neimenovic Wrote: I'm not asking you not to voice them. I'm pointing out that you are just as condescending as you accuse other people of being.
I don't think answering a question that was directly asked to me, and answering it honestly, kindly, and respectfully, is condescending to the other person. I think it shows consideration for their question and for doing what they asked me to do.
Sorry if you disagree, but on that we will just have to agree to disagree.
(June 25, 2015 at 1:06 pm)Alex K Wrote: (June 25, 2015 at 12:59 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Perhaps cancer is made worse by all the processed stuff we have freely chosen to put in our food
That's probably it, processed food is the culprit. So your God is off the hook for now, there's nothing he could have done. Whew, that was close.
*bites in keyboard*
...I also mentioned the damage we have done to the environment, which you have deleted from my quote above. ;-)
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
Posts: 7318
Threads: 75
Joined: April 18, 2015
Reputation:
73
RE: Do you wish God was real?
June 25, 2015 at 1:12 pm
(This post was last modified: June 25, 2015 at 1:14 pm by Longhorn.)
(June 25, 2015 at 1:03 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I have distinguished the difference between telling an atheist on this forum "God has mercy on you,"
...And honestly answering a question that was directly asked to me in reference to a third party.
I see a big difference between these 2, because the first one I would never do. I'm sorry if you think they are the exact same. But I was not lying in my response to you, I just disagree that they are the same thing.
Just for the record, the question was how would you feel about the church if you were gay.
My point is, you're condescending too and your beliefs are just offensive to me as my foul language is to you.
(June 25, 2015 at 1:09 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: (June 25, 2015 at 12:54 pm)Neimenovic Wrote: I'm not asking you not to voice them. I'm pointing out that you are just as condescending as you accuse other people of being.
I don't think answering a question that was directly asked to me, and answering it honestly, kindly, and respectfully, is condescending to the other person. I think it shows consideration for their question and for doing what they asked me to do.
Sorry if you disagree, but on that we will just have to agree to disagree.
Not to the other person, to the people you're sorry for.
|
