A few points of conflict with Jackie L's (Eilonnwy) article.

[Dotard]

In response to a idiotic comment Fr0d0 made

You're either the most sarcastic person I've ever encountered, or developmentally retarded.

I'd go with developmentally retarded.

[Spectrum]

Things are already changing. We’re further along than our mothers now. Our daughters will be further along than us. I see women in jobs that men traditionally have had, doing them well – dirty jobs too. Are we finished with the transformation into equality? Fuck no. But this is blame placing is no way to go about it. Accept that you were wrong in the past and fucking move forward already.

Yes. Just fucking, yes.

[fr0d0]

Jesus tapdancing Christ, fr0d0.

Getting you to recognize a logical, reasoned argument is fucking impossible.

This is you realising you're talking about a different subject I guess.

[Autumnlicious]

In that article, she recognizes hate is going both ways. Very reasonable. Very different from the new article.

[fr0d0]

(Historically, )in western culture, the vast majority of so called 'privileged white males' (have been and) still are Christian

That's certainly not the opinion of the mainstream church - far from it. Christians are active and manage to influence decisions, yes. And pre modern Christianity isn't what I recognise as Christian (as in following the teachings of Christ) at all.

yet this has clearly not impacted the eventual adoption of Christianity amongst non-(white males). So to say that if Privileged person holds position X then the unprivileged person is less likely to adopt position X is fallacious.

Did you word that wrong??

This was the whole point of her argument, white men are inhibiting the prominence of atheism. It's false, even the ones who are in fact assholes, like PZ Myers, are still contributing to the overall growth of atheism despite their tone or 'abuse of privilege'.

Yes I think atheism/ any world view becomes dominant more through popularity than reason.

---

Just gonna say one thing then I will go back to laughing my ass off.


I have never witnessed this many stupid and fallacious bullshit posts on a forum other then christianforums. The sheer number of overzealous and ignorant/arrogant posts by namely frodo is utterly disturbing.

What is funny is that now he will never understand the real issue at hand, because he has so much emotionally invested in this argument that he won't just give it up. He would look like an utter fool, more so then he already does.*

Now I can properly equate Ely as a theist thinker and frodo as someone who has been mentally stifled, brain damage.

*Note: This is an emotional reason people cling to religion as well. I'm seeing a correlation in frodos case.

^^ This post deserves a flashing border. Just wow! For a moment I thought I was at atheistforums.com

[Autumnlicious]

(Historically, )in western culture, the vast majority of so called 'privileged white males' (have been and) still are Christian

That's certainly not the opinion of the mainstream church - far from it. Christians are active and manage to influence decisions, yes. And pre modern Christianity isn't what I recognise as Christian (as in following the teachings of Christ) at all.

Goal post. Moving.

[Edwardo Piet]

The whole thing about the repulsive attitudes of certain atheists making any minority 'not want to be an atheist' is absolutely fucking ridiculous. You don't choose atheism whatsoever. You're either convinced by the proposition of God's existence or you're not. Whether you find atheism completely repulsive or utterly delightful or anywhere in-between is completely fucking irrelevant to whether you subscribe to it or not.

[thesummerqueen]

The whole thing about the repulsive attitudes of certain atheists making any minority 'not want to be an atheist' is absolutely fucking ridiculous. You don't choose atheism whatsoever. You're either convinced by the proposition of God's existence or you're not. Whether you find atheism completely repulsive or utterly delightful or anywhere in-between is completely fucking irrelevant to whether you subscribe to it or not.

I completely agree, but I think she'd argue about whether or not someone would choose to id themselves as atheist to anyone else at hand if they didn't want to be part of what they perceive as a community.

I still find trouble with it though because atheists range across the spectrum and picking on one particular demographic as a large reason why someone might not "out" themselves, even if they haven't believed in god all their life, is unfair.

[tavarish]

"Here is a hint, bucko. The reason this article pissed you off is because it called you on your privilege. You don't even fully realize how privileged you actually are.

Since you won't check your privilege, the answer to the question is 'we can't, because people like you don't'."

So not only is that making a blanket statement about people in the community, it's making me necessarily part of the problem - tying me in with the racist, homophobic and sexist people that are being discussed, and promoting a "us v them" mentality. I can't really make a better example of how this is the pot calling the kettle black.

[Autumnlicious]

Since when did plants start being racist?